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Thread: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I'm the one who would be lying and cheating? What gives you that idea. If I was happy lying and cheating, I'd be a stockbroker or annuities salesman, not a tax accountant.

    And for the rest of your points, you're conflating all kinds of things and I don't have the interest in untangling it all. Bottom line is lenders are responsible for making good loans - that is step one of "How to run a lending institution." Step 2 is maintain adequate reserves to protect your institution WHEN loans go bad. They fail step one and two, massively, pay themselves like kings while the going is good, and you blame the borrowers when the crap hits the fan. It's funny.



    Addressed elsewhere. Lenders operate exclusively to maximize profits, but you expect borrowers to repay a loan when the profit maximizing choice is to default? Hahaha....
    Well, clearly you have no interest in addressing the main point, which was that deadbeat jerks were walking away from bad investments and sticking the banks with their bad investment decisions by CHOICE. Over 25% of all defaults were these "strategic defaults", which went through the roof increasing in triple digit percentages. You apparently don't see anything wrong with that and that tells me everything I need to know about your integrity and it's why I suspect you'd be one of the people "fudging" applications for commissions.... after all, you're just "sticking it to the banks" when you do that and you clearly see no problem with people "sticking it to the banks".
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    If that was a bankruptcy attorney advising a corporate client, he'd be sued for malpractice and he'd lose if he didn't give that EXACT advice to his client.

    It's unclear to me why an individual has a moral obligation to repay a loan, but you'd demand that a corporation you held an interest in default if that was 1) legal, and 2) maximized shareholder return. Does corporate America also have a "liberal contempt for personal responsibility" or are you just applying one set of rules for the proles and another for businesses and plutocrats? I'm guessing the latter.
    Yeah, that's sort of the problem right there. It's why you are how you are about all this. The moral obligation to fulfill the obligation you accepted in good faith to repay money you borrowed is unclear to you and probably most liberals. It's about personal responsibility and, like all diehard liberals, you have no use for such silly ideals.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    see what I mean folks? no clue about what they are talking about.
    Everybody can't be rich.

    That's not how it works. Its not how ANY of it works.

    We wouldn't need capitalism without scarcity.

    And if everybody was "the 1%" it would be the 100%.

    So I was right and you are spouting nonsense.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Well, clearly you have no interest in addressing the main point, which was that deadbeat jerks were walking away from bad investments and sticking the banks with their bad investment decisions by CHOICE. Over 25% of all defaults were these "strategic defaults", which went through the roof increasing in triple digit percentages. You apparently don't see anything wrong with that and that tells me everything I need to know about your integrity and it's why I suspect you'd be one of the people "fudging" applications for commissions.... after all, you're just "sticking it to the banks" when you do that and you clearly see no problem with people "sticking it to the banks".
    Of course I have a personal problem with defaulting on debts. I've never failed to pay a debt in my life, and as we speak I have none. No mortgage, no car loans, no personal loans no nothing. Monthly credit card, paid off each month. It's weird you have to attribute a personal weakness or personality flaw onto everyone who disagrees. It would be easy for me to make up some for you, but I don't see the point in accusing you of having no integrity. Resorting to personal insults is what children do. It's petty and childish.

    What shouldn't surprise a corporate lender who has a duty to maximize profits using all legal methods available is that its customers behave in an IDENTICAL fashion and don't ELECT to pay off loans which it is in their best interests to default on. It's the common assumption in any business loan, which is why things like collateral, loan covenants, remedies in case of default, and all the rest of that 18 or 62 page agreement we all sign when we get a mortgage or just a new credit card are there. It's to maximize profit for the lender, and to shift the game in its favor at the FIRST opportunity. Miss one payment - your rate goes to 97%! No morality involved - just profits. I don't operate my own life that way but I understand defaulting on a mortgage when it is a good BUSINESS decision, and a loan is a BUSINESS transaction - not a moral one.

    And blaming the other side of a loan transaction for behaving EXACTLY like the lender would behave in similar circumstances is just pathetic whining of losers wanting to shift blame for their failures onto others. They begged those deadbeats to take loans and paid themselves handsomely, until the shiat hit the fan. They made their bed.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    If you are going to be part of the problem, then don't complain about the rich.

    It's hypocrisy.
    I have no problem with the rich.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Yeah, that's sort of the problem right there. It's why you are how you are about all this. The moral obligation to fulfill the obligation you accepted in good faith to repay money you borrowed is unclear to you and probably most liberals. It's about personal responsibility and, like all diehard liberals, you have no use for such silly ideals.
    That was a two-part statement and you ignored the second part:

    It's unclear to me why an individual has a moral obligation to repay a loan, but you'd demand that a corporation you held an interest in default if that was 1) legal, and 2) maximized shareholder return.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Yeah, that's sort of the problem right there. It's why you are how you are about all this. The moral obligation to fulfill the obligation you accepted in good faith to repay money you borrowed is unclear to you and probably most liberals. It's about personal responsibility and, like all diehard liberals, you have no use for such silly ideals.
    There was a 'but' there.

    No one here who is engaged in the market at any level believes the 'market' expects or demands businesses repay loans when electing NOT to would maximize shareholder value. Good gosh - business entity planning 101 is to isolate risk with various legally distinct entities for the express purpose of preventing losses in one "division" from bleeding into another and to isolate "business" loans from personal assets - it's a strategy on how to default on debt and maximize personal profits. Corporations are formed to shield owners from having to repay the debts of the company they own. Same with LLCs, LLPs, limited partnerships, and S Corps. It's why no one with any loss exposure does business as a sole proprietorship. There is no "morality" involved in these decisions - I've been part of many of them. It's how to protect individuals from losses, and they do so using EVERY LEGAL MEANS AVAILABLE TO THEM, as we all expect.

    Anyway, spare me from the faux morality. I'm not buying it. That mortgage holder has no more "moral obligation" to repay a loan than a member in an LLC or a shareholder in GE has a "moral" obligation to repay a business loan.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    That was a two-part statement and you ignored the second part:

    It's unclear to me why an individual has a moral obligation to repay a loan, but you'd demand that a corporation you held an interest in default if that was 1) legal, and 2) maximized shareholder return.
    Exactly.

    BTW, sorry I keep stepping on your posts. I'm drafting my responses while you're posting yours. Not trying to just repeat your points, we're just thinking along the same (rational) lines.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Exactly.

    BTW, sorry I keep stepping on your posts. I'm drafting my responses while you're posting yours. Not trying to just repeat your points, we're just thinking along the same (rational) lines.
    Not a problem with me. There is nothing worse than when I am debating a topic and I am getting attacked by four or five different posters, and that seems to happen a lot on this board.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: The 1% will own more than the 99% by 2016, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Everybody can't be rich.

    That's not how it works. Its not how ANY of it works.

    We wouldn't need capitalism without scarcity.

    And if everybody was "the 1%" it would be the 100%.

    So I was right and you are spouting nonsense.
    I never made any of these claims so therefore you have no idea what you are talking about.

    if you spent half the time working on something rather than complaining then you could be in the top 1% as well.

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