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Thread: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    No, the SCOTUS did not decide that "decades ago".

    There simply is no constitutional right to marry in violation of marriage's fundamental terms of between a man and a woman as husband and wife.

    If you're implying civil rights movements and color of skin, race, etc., that's not the implication of a constitutional right to marry.

    Eliminating discrimination on account of race and color in no way violated what marriage is: between a man and a woman as husband and wife.

    And with respect to gender, there currently is no ERA amendment in the constitution, nor is there any gender discrimination in marriage: a male and a female are both allowed to participate.

    oh, so you'd rather a homosexual would marry the opposite sex, perhaps your daughter? Got it



    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    You're missing one of the obvious SCOTUS concerns.

    The SCOTUS can't be doing a judicial activist thing on this issue and in any way explicitly/implicitly make marriage between any two people a constitutional right.

    If they do so, they'll be in conflict with the majority of Americans .. including some religious institutions.

    If then these religious institutions then refuse to marry two people of the same sex, thus making the religious institution itself in violation of federal "law", that would mean that the government could step in and force that church to marry those same-sex people.

    The SCOTUS is quite aware of the ramifications of such an erroneous judicial activist mistake.
    Sounding just like the mormon propaganda leading up to prop 8. SSM is legal in 36 states and i defy you to name a single case where a church was forced to marry gay couples. In MA, it's been almost a decade.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    They'll never go in that direction.
    gonna sig this when it happens, just heads up

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    It appears time and again that the SCOTUS splits along political lines. When splits should be along legal interpretation of the case. Am I off the mark here?
    Kenny was a Reagan appointee (much to dismay of neo cons everywhere), Roberts was a Bush II (tried to amend constitution to *ban* SSM), Ginsburg and Breyer under Clinton (despite being dem, signed in "DOMA" and "DADT"), and they will all almost certainly vote to establish SSM as a definite right. Does that sound political? These are lifetime appointments, so therein lies the diff from standard politics.

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    so put it up for a vote.
    ol I understand it perfectly.

    you made that claim that it is widely accepted yet you refuse to test that in a real test. why?
    you obviously do not feel that strongly about it then.
    You want us to turn for a solution to the same cesspool of uneducated theocrats who put us in this position in the first place? Not on your life

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    It's a bit more complicated than that. While some states banned SSM with a mere bill, others have a constitutional amendment. This is less about SSM and more about the conditions in which the Fed can audit a state's very constitution.
    The condition is simple: when the state constitutions violate the federal constitution. If they don't like it, they can stop passing unconstitutional laws. This shouldn't have been hard to foresee, even in 2004. That's why if it were up to me, these states would have to pay massive reparations

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Politics trumps ideology every time.
    not when you're a federal judge with lifetime appointment

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Kenny was a Reagan appointee (much to dismay of neo cons everywhere), Roberts was a Bush II (tried to amend constitution to *ban* SSM), Ginsburg and Breyer under Clinton (despite being dem, signed in "DOMA" and "DADT"), and they will all almost certainly vote to establish SSM as a definite right. Does that sound political? These are lifetime appointments, so therein lies the diff from standard politics.
    Thanks for the information on who appointed who.
    We have some crazy rulings as well. Lifetime appts here as well.
    They do not go thru the meat grinder that the Senate puts them thru in the US though.
    Court is not as activist as it once was in some cases.
    But SSM legalization is a slam dunk - If you believe in equal rights for all US citizens, then it is.
    If you support desperation of Church and State, then it is again.
    People on this should eave their religious beliefs at the door.
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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfsgirl View Post
    You might want to recheck those polls. A lot has changed since 2012.

    Civil Rights
    The correct question isn't the polemic dualism Y/N on the oxymoronic "gay marriage".

    The correct question is about legal recognition under 1) "marriage", 2) a term OTHER THAN "marriage", and 3) no recognition.

    That's the correct polling question to get an accurate take on where Americans stand.

    When this correct polling is done, the most recent one in your link is found on page two of your link (go to the bottom of page one, click on page two, then scan for the word "civil" until you come to the first poll, dated May 11-13 of 2012.

    There isn't a more current poll on this correct polling question than this one.

    The results: 38% recognition under the term "marriage", 24% recognition under a term OTHER THAN marriage, and 33% no legal recognition (regardless of term). 5% were unsure, essentially whether to vote with the 24% or the 33%.

    Regardless, by this poll, and I've seen other current polls where it's 37%, 33%, and 30%, the great majority -- 62-63 percent, closing in on almost two thirds of the country -- DO NOT favor "recognition under the term marriage".

    That's the most current on the proper polling question.

    So unless you can present a more current poll on the proper polling question, your response is erroneous.
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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    The condition is simple: when the state constitutions violate the federal constitution.
    The federal constitution says marriage is left to the state to regulate, per the 10th amendment. So no its not as easy as you think, not at sll, otherwise it would never have made it to SCOTUS.

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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    The correct question isn't the polemic dualism Y/N on the oxymoronic "gay marriage".

    The correct question is about legal recognition under 1) "marriage", 2) a term OTHER THAN "marriage", and 3) no recognition.

    That's the correct polling question to get an accurate take on where Americans stand.

    When this correct polling is done, the most recent one in your link is found on page two of your link (go to the bottom of page one, click on page two, then scan for the word "civil" until you come to the first poll, dated May 11-13 of 2012.

    There isn't a more current poll on this correct polling question than this one.

    The results: 38% recognition under the term "marriage", 24% recognition under a term OTHER THAN marriage, and 33% no legal recognition (regardless of term). 5% were unsure, essentially whether to vote with the 24% or the 33%.

    Regardless, by this poll, and I've seen other current polls where it's 37%, 33%, and 30%, the great majority -- 62-63 percent, closing in on almost two thirds of the country -- DO NOT favor "recognition under the term marriage".

    That's the most current on the proper polling question.

    So unless you can present a more current poll on the proper polling question, your response is erroneous.
    You can talk up the "correct" question all you like, but SCOTUS is discussing different questions than you.

    Polls are irrelevant. The constitution supersedes opinion polls.
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    Re: Supreme Court to take up same sex marriage issues in April

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    The correct question isn't the polemic dualism Y/N on the oxymoronic "gay marriage".

    The correct question is about legal recognition under 1) "marriage", 2) a term OTHER THAN "marriage", and 3) no recognition.

    That's the correct polling question to get an accurate take on where Americans stand.

    When this correct polling is done, the most recent one in your link is found on page two of your link (go to the bottom of page one, click on page two, then scan for the word "civil" until you come to the first poll, dated May 11-13 of 2012.

    There isn't a more current poll on this correct polling question than this one.

    The results: 38% recognition under the term "marriage", 24% recognition under a term OTHER THAN marriage, and 33% no legal recognition (regardless of term). 5% were unsure, essentially whether to vote with the 24% or the 33%.

    Regardless, by this poll, and I've seen other current polls where it's 37%, 33%, and 30%, the great majority -- 62-63 percent, closing in on almost two thirds of the country -- DO NOT favor "recognition under the term marriage".

    That's the most current on the proper polling question.

    So unless you can present a more current poll on the proper polling question, your response is erroneous.
    No one polls with those questions anymore, since the majority of states already have SSM. It is now a yes or no question.
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