Page 7 of 13 FirstFirst ... 56789 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 122

Thread: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

  1. #61
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    If Iraq weren't ****ed with at all we wouldn't be in this situation either. ever think of that?
    But we did get involved, so the choice became go home and have to come back in 3 years or stay and keep the peace.

    For politics, Obama chose to pull out-and its blown up in his face in spectacular fashion-so much so that he's been forced back in.

  2. #62
    Guru
    Hamster Buddha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 06:10 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    3,675

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    ISIS wasn't in Iraq (significantly) until we left. There is a variable there you must account for-our withdrawal.
    Yes but ISIS wasn't created as a result of American Withdrawal, instead it grew out of it's absence. The origins of ISIS were born out of the Arab Spring. I think we can all agree that American troops in the area wouldn't of prevented a Moroccan store owner from killing himself and launching the Arab Spring right? I think we can all also agree, ISIS would of still formed in Syria out of the Civil War there that came up.

    Then the question becomes if they would be able to roll through western Iraq with the ease they did. Your gut may say no, as of course ISIS is no match for the American Military. But there's a lot more considerations that would have to be taken into account. For instance, the local Sunny populace anger at the regime in Baghdad, would still be very sympathetic to ISIS coming in and offering them something better. This is also assuming that the Iraqi Government would of allowed the US Military to interfere in the early stages where some good could of occurred. At that time, Maliki had a lot to prove to his own people, specifically that he didn't need American support (aka not their puppet). This would lead to his overconfidence and allowing ISIS to push them back further and further. In the end, you've got a US military base in the middle of hostile territory, cut off from land routes of supply. We'd have Hamburger Hill in the desert.

    So no, I don't think even if we still had that Base manned and operational, would it of been able to stop ISIS. The politics in the area are still what they are.
    Last edited by Hamster Buddha; 01-17-15 at 06:48 AM.

  3. #63
    Paying To Play
    AJiveMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    wisconSIN
    Last Seen
    05-15-15 @ 04:04 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    5,775

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    But we did get involved, so the choice became go home and have to come back in 3 years or stay and keep the peace.

    For politics, Obama chose to pull out-and its blown up in his face in spectacular fashion-so much so that he's been forced back in.
    What about the status of forces agreement of November of 2008?

  4. #64
    Sage
    DDD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Republic of Dardania
    Last Seen
    05-06-17 @ 06:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,173

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    The problem is that this hasn't worked. I mean say what you will about Iraq, but the moment we took over, we were more than ready to hand over power to the Iraqis. And that just got blown up into a sectarian mess with Islam at the heart of it. Egypt ousted Mubarak, and what do the people do? They install the Muslim Brotherhood. We assist in the ousting in Lybia, and now that's a hot bed for Islamist. And Syria? Well, perhaps if we'd of kept our noses out of that, ISIS wouldn't of been a problem, especially of Saddam was still in power to prevent them from pushing as far in as they did. In every single circumstance we've given freedom to Muslims in the Middle East, it's blown up in our face (with the lone exception of Morocco).
    It is not a done deal. Perhaps it takes longer for it to work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Could it of eventually blown up in our faces down the road? Maybe, but maybe not. Every year we get closer to not having to rely so heavily on ME oil. And once we finally kick that habit, we can seal off the ME and let the whole place burn itself down. At the very least, it wouldn't be our problem anymore, so long as we aren't letting them into Europe.
    This has not worked neither,

    Isolating our lands and expecting the east to destroy themselves only allows for an all encompassing leader to emerge like: Genghiz Khan, Atill the Hun, Ottoman Empire, etc. Being proactive is better then reactive.
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

  5. #65
    Sage
    DDD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Republic of Dardania
    Last Seen
    05-06-17 @ 06:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,173

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    The saudi's are very totalitarian and they are so terrified of ISIS they are building a heavily fortified and armed wall to keep them out. I dont think that will work. If the house of saud goes down it will be horrifically bloody.
    Not sure what it had to do with my post?

    But I do not think ISIS would venture down with Saudi Arabia.
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

  6. #66
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by AJiveMan View Post
    What about the status of forces agreement of November of 2008?
    A transparent excuse. What about Obama's military advisors explaining what would happen?

  7. #67
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    Not sure what it had to do with my post?

    But I do not think ISIS would venture down with Saudi Arabia.
    Just that even a totalitarian state is terrified of ISIS.

  8. #68
    Guru
    Hamster Buddha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 06:10 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    3,675

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    It is not a done deal. Perhaps it takes longer for it to work.
    Fair Point. But then again, even though my New York Knicks are 5-36, doesn't their championship hopes are out of the question right?

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    This has not worked neither,

    Isolating our lands and expecting the east to destroy themselves only allows for an all encompassing leader to emerge like: Genghiz Khan, Atill the Hun, Ottoman Empire, etc. Being proactive is better then reactive.
    Don't you think that it would actually be in our strategic interests to allow a central organization to develop from this mess? After all, that'd just provide us a target to blow up after all.

  9. #69
    Guru
    Hamster Buddha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 06:10 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    3,675

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Just that even a totalitarian state is terrified of ISIS.
    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    Not sure what it had to do with my post?

    But I do not think ISIS would venture down with Saudi Arabia.
    Saudi Arabia and ISIS would never be allies. One's Sunni and the other's Shia with all the baggage that entails. Part of the reason for the Conflict in Iraq is that you have the Sunni ISIS that is pushing through friendly Sunni territory, and not is being resisted by Shia Iraq that will be backed by the Sauds.

    Something major would have to shift for these two to work together.

  10. #70
    Sage
    DDD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Republic of Dardania
    Last Seen
    05-06-17 @ 06:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,173

    Re: U.S. to begin to train and equip moderate Syria rebels

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Fair Point. But then again, even though my New York Knicks are 5-36, doesn't their championship hopes are out of the question right?
    The analogy fails to apply because championships are yearly campaigns, while our involvement in the east may be a lifetime involvement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Don't you think that it would actually be in our strategic interests to allow a central organization to develop from this mess? After all, that'd just provide us a target to blow up after all.
    Historically, that has been a bad idea. A central organization is too powerful, it becomes a greater factor, and destroying it then can only bring the centralized organization down to the current state of affairs. So dealing with it then would cost more and the result would be to bring it down to this level and then some more. While we are here, why allow it to?
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

Page 7 of 13 FirstFirst ... 56789 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •