• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

I have been to funerals at which there was no clergy. That is a choice people make.

Your knee jerk reaction to feed your anti-religion bias leaves you not considering other possibilities here. That a bunch of lesbians were able to snatch the coffin up and parade it across the street and supposedly have a funeral on the spot at another location leaves me questioning whether or not this was already expected and planned for as a staged victimhood event.

You say lesbians like that's a bad thing. And you say bias like you don't really understand what the word means.
 
Excuse me but the pastor told them ahead of time if they wanted him to officiate the funeral in his church, the same sex relationship could not be celebrated. Those who hired him did not honor that. If the family was not happy with the agreement, they could have sought someone else to do the service. They did not. If they wanted the same sex relationship highlighted in the service, they should have chose someone that was willing to do so.

I think stopping a funeral in this way is hideous. But openly defying the agreement created the problem.
 
You say lesbians like that's a bad thing. And you say bias like you don't really understand what the word means.

I say lesbian like it means a female who is sexually attracted to another female. Here you go, trolly, a gift, or in this case, a well deserved recognition of your contribution :failpail:
 
I am just finding this thread and am asking a favor, could you link me to where it talks about them springing anything on the church? I would appreciate it.

Go back, read the whole OP and then the thread thus far. The info is there. The pastor knew of their gay marriage a week before the funeral. Rules were laid down. The pictures were brought in by the family and when the pastor asked for them to be taken down before he proceeded, they moved the whole shebang rather than follow the rules.
 
I don't think you quite understand how this "tolerance" thing works. Obviously I don't like these demonstrations of religion, are you so amazed that I would have a difference of opinion? I'm here arguing for the church's right to run their church according to their principles, yet you have the nerve to call me a "hater?" If you want to see intolerance, look in the mirror and observe your belief that I don't have the right to disagree with the principles of your religion even though I'm arguing in favor of its followers having the right to practice their faith.

Not at all consistent with what you've been posting here, and called on your hatred of religion you decide to go soft because you know it's hate. I know very well how tolerance works, I also know how to recognize tactics and games. We have not been discussing whether this church had the right to refuse blessing until the offending material was removed. We were discussing your kneejerk comments about cruelty and lack of forgiveness.
 
So the pastor was okay with sending this sinner up into heaven.... as long as icky pictures weren't on display? :lol: The silliness of some religious ideas is incredible.
 
The pastor was upfront - it was those who arranged the funeral who chose to create a conflict, assuming that the pastor would allow them to run over the church. They are the ones who violated trust in this situation, and it is on their heads that the tragedy falls.

That's not what the OP says. The pastor was mad because he saw the photos of her and her wife.
 
I think stopping a funeral in this way is hideous. But openly defying the agreement created the problem.
Hidious? I wouldn't use that word Nota. No one in this country should be forced to go against their moral conscience regardless. If they couldn't abide by the pastor's request to use his church, what choice did they give him? They had no respect whatsoever for the pastor and defied his wishes. Luckily for them the funeral home was just across the street.
 
Last edited:
I am just finding this thread and am asking a favor, could you link me to where it talks about them springing anything on the church? I would appreciate it.

In the linked article in the OP, it says the family provided the pastor with a memorial video and it included images of her kissing and embracing her wife.
 
That's not what the OP says. The pastor was mad because he saw the photos of her and her wife.

Yes. Because he had clearly said that he could not allow the church to be used to celebrate the homosexual lifestyle, specifically in the manner that they tried to. That was part of the deal - "Yes, we can do the funeral. But in order to hold true to our beliefs, we cannot do A, B, or C". They broke the deal.


To shift it to a much more mundane example, if I were to ask to come into your house, and you were to reply "certainly, only take off those muddy boots please", and my reply was to stomp into your house with my boots on and wipe them off on your carpet.... I can't exactly complain when you ask me to leave that you are somehow being cruel to me. You let me into your house and I refused to follow the rules you asked me to.
 
Go back, read the whole OP and then the thread thus far. The info is there. The pastor knew of their gay marriage a week before the funeral. Rules were laid down. The pictures were brought in by the family and when the pastor asked for them to be taken down before he proceeded, they moved the whole shebang rather than follow the rules.

No, it's not in the link in the OP. If there is another site, then link that site. The link in the OP also says that the pastor has not reimbursed the family after stopping the funeral and kicking them out.
 
The article in the OP doesn't not say there was a pre arranged deal. It says that became the ultimatum once the pastor saw the photos of the deceased kissing her wife. The article also states:

Friends say they gave the church a remembrance video of Collier a week before that contained images of her kissing and embracing her wife. The pastor had every chance to stop the funeral long before it began, they said.

Collier's friends say they still haven't been reimbursed by New Hope Ministry for the cost of the funeral.

Yes. Because he had clearly said that he could not allow the church to be used to celebrate the homosexual lifestyle, specifically in the manner that they tried to. That was part of the deal - "Yes, we can do the funeral. But in order to hold true to our beliefs, we cannot do A, B, or C". They broke the deal.


To shift it to a much more mundane example, if I were to ask to come into your house, and you were to reply "certainly, only take off those muddy boots please", and my reply was to stomp into your house with my boots on and wipe them off on your carpet.... I can't exactly complain when you ask me to leave that you are somehow being cruel to me. You let me into your house and I refused to follow the rules you asked me to.
 
So the pastor was okay with sending this sinner up into heaven.... as long as icky pictures weren't on display? :lol: The silliness of some religious ideas is incredible.
This pastor wasn't sending the deceased anywhere. He was hired to give a Eulogy using his church building to highlight the good in the life of the deceased to comfort those who mourned their loss. Unfortunately those who hired him could not abide by his wishes. They expected him to compromise his beliefs to accommodate them.

Moral to the story, if you want something "YOUR WAY", hire someone willing to give it to you. Don't expect others to cowtail and compromise their beliefs to accommodate you. Especially when those beliefs are made known up front and ignored by the one who hired you.
 
This pastor wasn't sending the deceased anywhere. He was hired to give a Eulogy using his church building to highlight the good in the life of the deceased to comfort those who mourned their loss. Unfortunately those who hired him could not abide by his wishes. They expected him to compromise his beliefs to accommodate them.

Moral to the story, if you want something "YOUR WAY", hire someone willing to give it to you. Don't expect others to cowtail and compromise their beliefs to accommodate you. Especially when those beliefs are made known up front and ignored by the one who hired you.

He could have complained to the family when he saw the memorial video of her kissing her wife, but the family says he didn't raise any concern. Furthermore, he has hasn't refunded the family the funeral costs he charged them.
 
This pastor wasn't sending the deceased anywhere.

Okay, I'll point it out to you: I was making a caricature of the entire ritual. I find it stupid that he was fine doing the service, as long as the gayness was put in a box for a little while.
 
After coming to the realization that the family of this woman had not complied with his stipulations the pastor was in a no win situation. Had he gone on with the service at that point no one would have ever heard a word about it and the pastor would have been left with the knowledge that people walked into his house and treated him like a punk. Choosing to stand up for himself has brought down a whole boatload of negative publicity.

He made the decision he made and I feel bad for the guy but I feel worse for the woman who's legacy is now tainted by this.

Is RIP really too much to ask?
 
Go back, read the whole OP and then the thread thus far. The info is there. The pastor knew of their gay marriage a week before the funeral. Rules were laid down. The pictures were brought in by the family and when the pastor asked for them to be taken down before he proceeded, they moved the whole shebang rather than follow the rules.

I just read the intial story and looked for any more links through the entire thread. Since there arent any the facts of the story, at this point, is he new that she was a lesbian with a wife and didnt tell them anything before hand. He was not legally wrong for what he did but it was very wrong that he done it. I am willing to look over any more facts if people can provide them.
 
After coming to the realization that the family of this woman had not complied with his stipulations the pastor was in a no win situation. Had he gone on with the service at that point no one would have ever heard a word about it and the pastor would have been left with the knowledge that people walked into his house and treated him like a punk. Choosing to stand up for himself has brought down a whole boatload of negative publicity.

He made the decision he made and I feel bad for the guy but I feel worse for the woman who's legacy is now tainted by this.

Is RIP really too much to ask?

Which stipulations? Where is such stipulation mentioned?
 
Which stipulations? Where is such stipulation mentioned?
Apparently the family was told that he did not want anything "celebrating a homosexual lifestyle" as part of the service.
 
I have no idea. I'm not the one making claims that I speak for God.
Sigh....

You state the book is not the work of God. OK. Is there a God? If not...consistent...OK...I can dig that. If so...where did you learn of this God?
 
I think stopping a funeral in this way is hideous. But openly defying the agreement created the problem.

The OP's article does not say that they were told in advance that they could not reveal that the dead person was a lesbian. Anyone who claims that based on the linked article is lying.

"Friends say they gave the church a remembrance video of Collier a week before that contained images of her kissing and embracing her wife. The pastor had every chance to stop the funeral long before it began, they said."
Family: Church in Lakewood stops woman's funeral because she was gay - The Denver Post
 
After it was begun. Again showing a wantonness because he (the pastor) does not like the gay lifestyle. Whether or not the family agreed to limiting certain aspects of her lifestyle or not is beside the point. The "pastor" should have known that pictures celebrating her life were going to include pictures with her chosen mate. If he did not want them displayed in his church he should not have agreed to the funeral in the first place. By allowing it to start and then trying to stop it after it began because of a few pictures that show her with her mate is again wantonness. I am not saying he didn't have the right to do it. I am saying everyone should decry him as the cruel bastard he has shown himself to be.

Well said.

He should have just refused in the first place. Restricting pictures of the dead person with her spouse is cruel. And denying the funeral at the last minute is just - wrong.

Stressful enough having someone you love die. But then to have this happen at the funeral. Awful.
 
Go back, read the whole OP and then the thread thus far. The info is there. The pastor knew of their gay marriage a week before the funeral. Rules were laid down. The pictures were brought in by the family and when the pastor asked for them to be taken down before he proceeded, they moved the whole shebang rather than follow the rules.

Quote the section of the OP's article that says the rules were stated in advance.
 
Back
Top Bottom