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Thread: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

  1. #51
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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    Maybe you should be asking yourself why those insisted in violating the pastor's rules for the church he shepherds were not respected by the deceased's family? If they wanted the funeral in his church they had to follow his rules and they did not showing no respect for the beliefs of the pastor that they chose off the Internet because they couldn't muster up one between all the friends and family present.
    I never claimed the family was right. To stop a funeral after it has started over a picture is not a very good portrayal of the Gospel presented in the bible. Maybe if the family had let him pass the offering plate around he would have let them stay!

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    I gave similar examples, except mine were more ambiguous...as is kissing someone. Kissing someone is not inherently sinful....is there lust inherent in kisses? No. If the congregation chooses to attach that value to it then it's no different than them attaching sin to a woman kissing a man not her husband or someone toasting friends (in a congregation against drinking).
    Kissing her...homosexual partner? Come on...you are being disingenuous. At best.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    "Cherry picking?" So are you condemning the church's actions then? Because if an atheist committed a crime that I obviously condemned and you (as just an example) said that the crime represented atheistic behavior, then I could safely say you were cherry picking. But if you and several other Christians gather to defend the church's actions in this case, then it can't be said that I'm cherry picking, but that I'm taking note of a very real Christian trait when taken to fundamentalist levels.
    No I am not condemning the church's actions. The pastor had every right to refuse the funeral in his church because those who hired him did not respect his beliefs or wishes. This is just another example of others wanting to force someone to compromise their beliefs and when they won't you want to declare they are un-Christian? What a bunch of crap.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    No it's not.

    It's not reasonable. It's insulting and vial for anyone to dare have the balls to stick their nose into the private affairs of a family in that way and muss things up.
    Private affairs? Once they requested to hold the funeral on another person's property, it quit being a "private affair".

    You do have a valid point in that the funeral was interrupted after permission was given. The Pastor should have discreetly left the room to avoid giving affirmation, then changed the church protocols to advise families in advance as to what may, or may not be actively presented during a funeral.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    I think the pastor should have told them upfront he wasn't comfortable with doing them and sent them elsewhere, instead of deciding right before the ceremony that he didn't like the pictures. Perhaps it was a question of interpretation - what he feels are "too celebratory of a lesbian lifestyle" (or whatever) they may have seen as just "depicting a loving relationship".

    I think the way he did it was cruel and contrary to his profession. Was it his right? Sure. But was he right to do it? No.
    I agree...certainly ham-fisted. I personally dont agree with how it was handled by either party. Then again...I dont view 'sin' the way most people do either.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by smb View Post
    So what your saying is that no one who acts unchristian cannot have church wedding or burial? By my experience that is every "Christian" I have met. There has been and will be no human that lives up to the Christian ideal. You just choose believe one sin is more egregious than others and use that to defend cruelty. I could see if the family placed pictures of the woman having sex with her partner being a problem. That is not the case. It was showing her in her best moments as all people want to be remembered. Some of those best moments were with her chosen partner...big surprise. The minister showed a wantonness thinly veiled as religiosity simply because he does not like their lifestyle.
    No that is not what I am stating at all. Go back and re-read my post. The minister does not recognize same sex relationships and refused to have one highlighted in his sanctuary. Those who hired him to perform the Christian funeral refused to honor the pastors requests. So the funeral was moved across the street to the funeral home.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    No I am not condemning the church's actions.
    Then I'm not cherry picking.

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    The pastor had every right to refuse the funeral in his church because those who hired him did not respect his beliefs or wishes. This is just another example of others wanting to force someone to compromise their beliefs and when they won't you want to declare they are un-Christian? What a bunch of crap.
    And if your only rebuttal is the strawman that I'm claiming the church didn't have this right, then you have no leg to stand on. Although you'll probably ignore this again, I'll repeat that the church had this right, and that my position is this church has done us a favor by painting a microcosm of society if created in their image, and I'm grateful they didn't bother to hide their true colors.

    This story is, in essence, educational. It teaches us why a secular instead of a strongly religious political system is necessary.
    Last edited by Cardinal; 01-14-15 at 07:29 PM.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Then I'm not cherry picking.



    And if your only rebuttal is the strawman that I'm claiming the church didn't have this right, then you have no leg to stand on. Although you'll probably ignore this again, I'll repeat that the church had this right, and that my position is the church has done us a favor by painting a microcosm of society if created in their image, and I'm grateful they didn't bother to hide their true colors.

    This story is, in essence, educational.
    Educational how? That there are those who want a minister in their time of need but refuse to honor his convictions, rules in using his church that he shepherds? Expecting the pastor to compromise in his beliefs in order to fulfill their wishes? Then yes, it is an educational moment.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    Educational how? That there are those who want a minister in their time of need but refuse to honor his convictions, rules in using his church that he shepherds? Expecting the pastor to compromise in his beliefs in order to fulfill their wishes? Then yes, it is an educational moment.
    Nope. If the pastor feels that it's his place to condemn and exile gays, or if the head of that other church feels it's his place to fire a pregnant woman for not being married in a timely manner, then I believe they should demonstrate this clearly and publicly so we can all observe and make educated decisions before choosing a religious-based political system. We deserve to know what sort of society we'd be living under in a theocracy.

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    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by 11Bravo View Post
    To the church's defense, this was a RELIGIOUS ceremony. That's a fine line you're walking. Do I disagree with what they did? Yes. But remember, it's their religious ceremony.
    I think it is sick and cruel and stupid... The pastor should be ashamed and his congregation should be outraged.

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