Page 21 of 25 FirstFirst ... 111920212223 ... LastLast
Results 201 to 210 of 242

Thread: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

  1. #201
    Sage
    Excon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Last Seen
    10-14-17 @ 01:26 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,997

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    "...The pastor who called off the funeral defended his actions to KCNC, saying he hadn't been aware of the video until right before the service, and that he gave the family the chance to edit it.
    [...]
    I have read several articles, none of which indicate that advanced notice (more than 15 minutes) was provided to the family. All such claims are a lie.
    No. It doesn't make it automatically a lie. (see below. They gave a video for review (which suggests they had advanced notice of the standards) that was misplaced)

    This whole story is sparse on reliable details and appears to have a certain spin away from actual facts.
    How things are worded have effect on how they are perceived.

    One detail many haven't reported is that the Police say her death may have been suicide.

    Regardless. Here is some relevant information.


    Rolando, another friend of Collier's family, said New Hope Ministries "dropped the ball" by misplacing the video that the family originally gave them the day before the funeral.

    "They lost the video and asked for another copy," he told KMGH. "When it was reviewed, they realized there was content that involved kissing."

    Rolando said the church had passed the $400 fee that the family paid for the service to the funeral home. The family wants their money back, Silva said.

    Protests at Colorado church over handling of gay woman's funeral - CNN.com

    Giving a video to review ahead of time clearly suggests that it was known there were standards that needed to be met.


    The funeral was finally held at the Newcomer Funeral Home, with Chaplain Gary Rolando presiding, reports the Denver Channel. Rolando told the station he knew that Collier lived “an alternative lifestyle,” adding that he is a friend of Collier’s father. He said the New Hope chapel didn’t want “overt, open homosexuality.”
    Vanessa Collier: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com


    According to Chaplain Gary Rolando, who would later preside over the funeral across the street at Newcomer Funeral Home, the New Hope Ministry is very community oriented. He says pastors there welcome those who are gay but ask that alternative lifestyles be censored in the church.
    Protest after church rejects funeral photos of lesbian

    The above underlined comment isn't just referring to this incident and shows a knowledge concerning their overall operation.


    Higley wrote on Facebook: "Vanessa's services were NOT refused because she is a 'lesbian'. Her services were refused because we would not let New Hope Ministries 'edit' her life which was a slideshow of our family photos including our engagement and family photos of her and I with our two children! It never crossed my mind that it would be an issue considering we paid to use their facility ONLY. We brought in our own Pastor to facilitate. I would completely understand if we were asking to be married there and it be a conflict of interest.

    Outrage as pastor halts funeral for gay woman | Christian News on Christian Today
    Last edited by Excon; 01-15-15 at 03:48 PM.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

  2. #202
    Guru

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Last Seen
    12-12-17 @ 11:27 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    3,899

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    There is no dispute over the facts except by a few liars posting in this thread.

    The family only rented the space and used their own pastor.
    A week before the event the church's pastor was given a copy of the video that they planned to show.
    He did not look at it. He did not provide the family with any rules related to his anti-gay taboo.
    Fifteen minutes after the scheduled start time the church's pastor voiced his objection to a photo of the deceased with her partner shown in the video and told them to edit out the photo. (which was not possible at the time)
    When they showed the video he halted the event.
    There seem to be two very distinct spins on what happened:
    A. "Pastor is a mega jerk" vs
    B. "family forces an avoidable confrontation and turns funeral into a protest"

    Maybe the truth is in the middle?

  3. #203
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    54,677

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    "...An hour-long viewing of Collier's body had just finished and the memorial service was 15 minutes underway when Chavez stopped it, those in attendance said."

    Friends say they gave the church a remembrance video of Collier a week before that contained images of her kissing and embracing her wife. The pastor had every chance to stop the funeral long before it began, they said..."
    Family: Church in Lakewood stops woman's funeral because she was gay - The Denver Post

    "...The pastor who called off the funeral defended his actions to KCNC, saying he hadn't been aware of the video until right before the service, and that he gave the family the chance to edit it.

    "New Hope did their absolutely very best to accommodate this family in their hour of need,"Chaplain Gary Rolando said.

    He also told KMGH, "We don't want overt, open homosexuality in our sanctuary." But he did offer an apology, saying, "New Hope is very sorry. ... It's very sad that it happened the way that it did."
    Colorado church canceled lesbian woman's funeral, family says | Seattle News, Weather, Traffic, Video and Sports | KIRO 7... | www.kirotv.com

    I have read several articles, none of which indicate that advanced notice (more than 15 minutes) was provided to the family. All such claims are a lie.
    "Relatives of a Colorado woman say they were forced to move her funeral – 15 minutes before the scheduled start of the service – over objections to a video showing highlights from the openly lesbian woman’s life.

    Vanessa Collier died Dec. 30 at the age of 33. She was survived by her wife, Christina Higley, as well as the couple’s two children, ages 12 and 7.

    Hundreds of Collier’s closest family and friends packed into New Hope Ministries in Lakewood, Colorado Saturday to celebrate her life. But minutes before the start of the funeral service, relatives say they were shocked to hear that the funeral service would not be able to continue."
    Relatives Livid After Colorado Church Objects to Lesbian's Funeral - ABC News

    You play a little fast and loose with the 'lie' comment. ABC is a pretty liberal site...are they also 'lying'? CNN? USAToday?

    I think you see what you want to see.

  4. #204
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:20 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    There is no dispute over the facts except by a few liars posting in this thread.
    Your so-called "facts" are disputed by most first hand accounts of those involved, including the funeral director and the family friend who conducted the service.

    Yes, a video was provided beforehand (2 days, not 1 week) that the church should have viewed, but didn't. The funeral home across the street was well aware of the church policy, but the family had hired an unaffiliated funeral director who was apparently unaware.

    There is no evidence that the pastor waited 15 minutes after the scheduled start time to voice an objection, or that the family played the video anyway, causing the pastor to halt the event. None of this is "fact." The service was to begin at 10:30. It was announced at 10:15 that they were going to move the funeral across the street (15 minutes prior to the start time, but 15 minutes after they began seating).

    It was the family that decided to halt the event, not the pastor. The church refused to display a couple of the pictures in their sanctuary, so the family decided to go elsewhere.

  5. #205
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:20 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    There seem to be two very distinct spins on what happened:
    A. "Pastor is a mega jerk" vs
    B. "family forces an avoidable confrontation and turns funeral into a protest"

    Maybe the truth is in the middle?
    There's also the fiction put forth by agenda-driven reporters who are making idiotic declarations like:

    "Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay" (op)
    "Pastor stops woman's funeral after learning she was gay"
    "Denver Pastor Stops Funeral After Realizing Deceased Was Gay, Family Devestated" (sic)
    "Colorado pastor stops a lesbian’s funeral mid-service because wife would be mentioned"

  6. #206
    Noblesse oblige
    Ockham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Last Seen
    01-27-17 @ 07:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    23,909
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    Pretty sure the church has been burying gays and lesbians since, well, the church began.....
    Pretty sure it's only been widely accepted socially in the past 10 years.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  7. #207
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    No. It doesn't make it automatically a lie. (see below. They gave a video for review (which suggests they had advanced notice of the standards) that was misplaced)

    This whole story is sparse on reliable details and appears to have a certain spin away from actual facts.
    How things are worded have effect on how they are perceived.

    One detail many haven't reported is that the Police say her death may have been suicide.

    Regardless. Here is some relevant information.


    Rolando, another friend of Collier's family, said New Hope Ministries "dropped the ball" by misplacing the video that the family originally gave them the day before the funeral.

    "They lost the video and asked for another copy," he told KMGH. "When it was reviewed, they realized there was content that involved kissing."

    Rolando said the church had passed the $400 fee that the family paid for the service to the funeral home. The family wants their money back, Silva said.

    Protests at Colorado church over handling of gay woman's funeral - CNN.com

    Giving a video to review ahead of time clearly suggests that it was known there were standards that needed to be met.


    The funeral was finally held at the Newcomer Funeral Home, with Chaplain Gary Rolando presiding, reports the Denver Channel. Rolando told the station he knew that Collier lived “an alternative lifestyle,” adding that he is a friend of Collier’s father. He said the New Hope chapel didn’t want “overt, open homosexuality.”
    Vanessa Collier: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com


    According to Chaplain Gary Rolando, who would later preside over the funeral across the street at Newcomer Funeral Home, the New Hope Ministry is very community oriented. He says pastors there welcome those who are gay but ask that alternative lifestyles be censored in the church.
    Protest after church rejects funeral photos of lesbian

    The above underlined comment isn't just referring to this incident and shows a knowledge concerning their overall operation.


    Higley wrote on Facebook: "Vanessa's services were NOT refused because she is a 'lesbian'. Her services were refused because we would not let New Hope Ministries 'edit' her life which was a slideshow of our family photos including our engagement and family photos of her and I with our two children! It never crossed my mind that it would be an issue considering we paid to use their facility ONLY. We brought in our own Pastor to facilitate. I would completely understand if we were asking to be married there and it be a conflict of interest.

    Outrage as pastor halts funeral for gay woman | Christian News on Christian Today
    Not a single article, nor the pastor's quote claims that the family was given warnings about taboo pictures until 15 minutes after the scheduled start of the event. The family says that they provided the video a week before the event, the reason that they did that is not mentioned.

    The Big Lie is that the family was given advanced warning about the taboo pictures and chose to ignore it. The undisputed fact is that they were not given warnings about taboo pictures until 15 minutes after the scheduled start of the event.

  8. #208
    Sage

    vesper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Midwest
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:35 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,866

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    The pastor's request to edit the video was given to the family fifteen minutes after the scheduled start of the event.
    That's not my understanding from the accounts I have read.

    Anyone who has gone through this knows the family has to go to the funeral home to pick out the casket, the vault, make arrangements for internment and provide the funeral home with the clothing the deceased will be wearing. They help you write the obituary, pick out memorial cards, down to the details of what type of music is to be played. Newcomer funeral homes which is where the deceased was taken, provide a service to the family of a tribute video made put to music of family photos. They ask you to bring in the photos to be included. At that time you are also asked how many days of the showing and if the funeral home will be setting up for the Eulogy and how many did the family expect would be attending.
    The family was expecting aprox. 200 people according to reports. I believe ultimately the reports stated 168-175 in attendance. Now anyone who has attended a funeral at a Newcomer Funeral Home knows the design is basically one large room partitioned off as needed with curtains for showings/funerals. One partitioned area can seat about 100 comfortably. It really is a no frills funeral home chain and that is why they can save the family thousands in costs in fees. Which leads me to believe this family wasn't looking for a church for a Christian burial as much as they were looking for a place that would accommodate the large number of family and friends that were attending the funeral. As usually is the case when someone dies suddenly. The deceased was a 33 year old woman who died from a self inflicted gunshot wound while cleaning her gun. The church was located directly across the street from the funeral home. You have to ask yourself why would a same sex couple choose a church to hold a funeral service that does not recognize same sex unions? Doesn't add up except they were just wanting to use the church as a place that would accommodate their family and friends out of convenience.

    Anytime a body needs to be moved to another location for the Eulogy, it is done so hours before the funeral. All the flowers, the tribute memorial video , the memorial cards, the book for those attending to sign, the flowers, everything that was at the funeral home is set up at the church. There is usually an hour before the funeral for the immediate family to come and mourn privately before the service and the church has people on staff to be there to see to their needs. It was then the family told the pastor that they wanted the tribute video played during the service.

    The church reviewed the video and found a couple of pictures unacceptable and asked the family to edit them or he would not be able to do the service.
    David Campanella, area manager for Newcomer Funeral Home in Lakewood, where the service was eventually moved, said they handled all of the funeral services for Collier's family when at the last minute the ceremony for Collier was moved from the church to the funeral home.

    "Certain events were not going to be allowed to take place according to the church," Campanella said. "In talking with family we decided it would be best to have the services here."

    So the service was delayed 15 minutes from the time it was to start because other arrangements had to be made to relocate the funeral and find another person to officiate it because the family would not abide by the pastor's wishes in his sanctuary.

  9. #209
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    ....There is no evidence that the pastor waited 15 minutes after the scheduled start time to voice an objection, or that the family played the video anyway, causing the pastor to halt the event
    The lies keep coming:
    "However, the family did not receive any word that they would be turned away until 15 minutes after the memorial service was already scheduled to begin."
    Lakewood Church Refuses to Host Lesbian Funeral - World Religion News

  10. #210
    Pontificator
    iliveonramen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    On a Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    9,166

    Re: Family: Lakewood church stops woman's funeral because she was gay

    Quote Originally Posted by 11Bravo View Post
    To the church's defense, this was a RELIGIOUS ceremony. That's a fine line you're walking. Do I disagree with what they did? Yes. But remember, it's their religious ceremony.
    It's also a contract, and either have qualifying questions before agreeing to a funeral or do your research ahead of time.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

Page 21 of 25 FirstFirst ... 111920212223 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •