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Thread: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

  1. #171
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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    But there is an immediate chance of injury - you can only treat cancer in its early stages when it's in its early stages.
    I thought in reading this story that she was diagnosed with hodgkins lymphoma, which isn't a very fast moving cancer. I don't believe she was in imminent danger of death.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I guess I'm not much moved by the fact she's an immature 17 years old versus 12 or 4. I understand your point, but we just disagree, which is fine.
    Ok
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    I thought in reading this story that she was diagnosed with hodgkins lymphoma, which isn't a very fast moving cancer. I don't believe she was in imminent danger of death.

    8 percent die within the first year , usually because they did not start treatment in time.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    8 percent die within the first year , usually because they did not start treatment in time.
    Which is fine - I'm all for people having and expressing their choice without interference. Do children really belong to parents or are they really pseudo-wards of the state where the state can intercede because (using an extreme example) that the child is not eating enough leafy greens, therefore the child is removed from the home, made a ward of the state and fed spinach salad?
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Which is fine - I'm all for people having and expressing their choice without interference. Do children really belong to parents or are they really pseudo-wards of the state where the state can intercede because (using an extreme example) that the child is not eating enough leafy greens, therefore the child is removed from the home, made a ward of the state and fed spinach salad?
    Yes, your example is extreme.
    Will the child die without leafy greens?

    By the way
    I think you were confusing
    Non-Hodgkin Lymphoma with Hodgkin Lymphoma when you said you thought it was not a fast moving cancer.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  5. #175
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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Yes, your example is extreme.
    Will the child die without leafy greens?
    Perhaps not as quickly as hodgkins lymphoma but yes... Obese Kids' Artery Plaque Similar To Middle-aged Adults -- ScienceDaily

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    By the way
    I think you were confusing
    Non-Hodgkin Lymphoma with Hodgkin Lymphoma when you said you thought it was not a fast moving cancer.
    I may be. I haven't been keeping up on the medical side of the issue - more on the political side.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Which is fine - I'm all for people having and expressing their choice without interference. Do children really belong to parents or are they really pseudo-wards of the state where the state can intercede because (using an extreme example) that the child is not eating enough leafy greens, therefore the child is removed from the home, made a ward of the state and fed spinach salad?
    I understand drawing that mythical line is difficult, but it's easy to go to the other extreme - should the state be able to intercede if a child is being raised in a house where they're cooking meth and poisoning the child on a daily basis? Of course.

    Bottom line is we'd all come to a case where the choice is difficult, but here we disagree on the line, but as far as I can tell not about whether there is one, or that there are cases where the state CAN/SHOULD intercede.

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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I understand drawing that mythical line is difficult, but it's easy to go to the other extreme - should the state be able to intercede if a child is being raised in a house where they're cooking meth and poisoning the child on a daily basis? Of course.

    Bottom line is we'd all come to a case where the choice is difficult, but here we disagree on the line, but as far as I can tell not about whether there is one, or that there are cases where the state CAN/SHOULD intercede.
    Agreed.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Which is fine - I'm all for people having and expressing their choice without interference. Do children really belong to parents or are they really pseudo-wards of the state where the state can intercede because (using an extreme example) that the child is not eating enough leafy greens, therefore the child is removed from the home, made a ward of the state and fed spinach salad?
    You are conflating "unhealthy diet" with "she must have this treatment for a fatal illness or she will die."

    Really, dude?
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Minors cannot consent to medical treatments.

    Some schools will not even allow teens to take a Tylenol without a note/prescription from their doctor.
    An abortion is a medical treatment. As a 17 year old she could have an abortion without her parents' consent.
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    Re: APNewsBreak: Girl says she knows she'll die without chemo

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Which is fine - I'm all for people having and expressing their choice without interference. Do children really belong to parents or are they really pseudo-wards of the state where the state can intercede because (using an extreme example) that the child is not eating enough leafy greens, therefore the child is removed from the home, made a ward of the state and fed spinach salad?
    Interesting question. However, I think it can be answered with a more serious question. What does the state do when parents are starving a child? Are the children kept in the home? Or is it determined that the parent's have a right to starve the child because children belong to them? It is clear that if in the end, the parent's proposed plan of action will lead to the child's death (like not going through chemo would), then the state must step in and do what is necessary to save that child's life as the parent's demonstrate they don't have the best interest. Do you disagree?

    I edited: Please respond to reflect that.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 01-12-15 at 07:18 PM.
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