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Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

Really? Love sucks? Friendships suck? Breathing sucks? Learning something sucks? Or do you not believe that people learn every single day of their lives even beyond schools?

Whoosh.
 
You're right. I do find contempt in the "me" complex. It is deserving of such.

Then I suppose you realize that demanding stuff for free is an expression of the me complex.
 
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It could. Depends on the relationship.

It could. Depends on who your friends are.

It could. Depends on the air you are breathing.

It could. Depends on the learning environment.

Then why bring up the idea of free 2 year community college education at all? Just let their life experiences guide them to prosperity.

1: You can do "what if's" all day long. You know what I mean so don't pretend that you don't. Highest form of dishonesty is to pretend ignorance to try and push a stupid agenda.

2: If life experience alone was enough then we wouldn't need schools at all huh?
 

Nope, just an argument that people don't want to admit is true.

Then I suppose you realize that depending stuff for free is an expression of the me complex.

You might have to clarify this. But honestly you don't need to. I know that I'm in the minority here and nothing that I'm going to say will convince anyone here to put aside the "me" values that is so intertwined in today's society. I'm done with this thread.
 
1: You can do "what if's" all day long. You know what I mean so don't pretend that you don't. Highest form of dishonesty is to pretend ignorance to try and push a stupid agenda.

Not one is playing a what if game. My responses of mere real life examples, and its from the experience of someone who is a single, lonely person who is living in a highly polluted city with a top notch education. Obviously, there are certain things that do not require money, because they are conditional to our nature, such as friends and breathing.

Education, on the other hand, is not a product of your nature, and it's a byproduct of the quality on puts into it. After all, we don't want people learning that the earth is flat, and people never landed on the moon. People just don't simple education. They need good education. That is already severely lacking in the secondary school level, and students are not going to recieve it at the community college level.

2: If life experience alone was enough then we wouldn't need schools at all huh?

That is what you are implying...
 
Nope, just an argument that people don't want to admit is true.


You might have to clarify this. But honestly you don't need to. I know that I'm in the minority here and nothing that I'm going to say will convince anyone here to put aside the "me" values that is so intertwined in today's society. I'm done with this thread.

Argh...I wish you quoted me after the edit. :D Anyway, people desiring things for free at other peoples expense are just as selfish as those that refuse to help anyone.
 
Nope, just an argument that people don't want to admit is true.

I'm pretty sure that things from nature being free has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of free things in the marketplace.
 
Argh...I wish you quoted me after the edit. :D Anyway, people desiring things for free at other peoples expense are just as selfish as those that refuse to help anyone.

I'm responding due to this post and your edit otherwise I wouldn't have. I figured it was only fair.

To your post: Except that having free education isn't about one person or even a small group of people with in society. It's about the benefits for the whole of society.

I'm pretty sure that things from nature being free has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of free things in the marketplace.

Friendship has nothing to do with nature. It is a human societal concept. And love also isn't found in nature, sexual instincts are, but not love.
 
I'm responding due to this post and your edit otherwise I wouldn't have. I figured it was only fair.

To your post: Except that having free education isn't about one person or even a small group of people with in society. It's about the benefits for the whole of society.

Providing someone an education is a service for the direct benefit of the individual receiving the education. There is of course secondary benefits to providing people with an education that relates to society, but that is purpose of it.


Friendship has nothing to do with nature. It is a human societal concept. And love also isn't found in nature, sexual instincts are, but not love.

Of course it has something to do with nature. It's in our nature to form friendships and love is a feeling and like all feelings is natural.
 
I don't know that 2 years of free community college is the answer, but college tuition is an enormous problem in our society. The cost of tuition has risen sooooo much that to the younger generations, it's become a matter of risking your entire life being ruined for something you're told you have to do. That's a lousy choice to have to make, and it's not a choice that the older generations had to make.

When you're hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt and your credit is in danger of being ruined, things like internships and taking time to look for the right job become impossible. You have to take whatever job you can get in order to pay the bills, and it creates unproductive members of society which is in turn bad for everybody. I went to a private college for one semester before dropping out and choosing technical college instead (because it was within my means) so I'm not trying to elicit sympathy with my sob story here. I'm just pointing out that railing against free or discounted education are maybe being a bit irrational. Insisting that education remains absurdly expensive is what's really irrational -- and just plain stupid.
 
Good news.

Do whatever it takes to get more people educated. If price was the issue then now the first 2 years it is free.

In Dardania Republic only the 1st year is free.
 
Where you attended school matters just as much as what your major is, contrary to popular belief. Plenty of research have shown that the more elite the school you have attended, the higher paychecks the alumi receive.

So while the idea of free two year community college may SOUND good in theory, it's not going to help in the long run.

It depends on the degree. Sure for a law degree it matters where you went to law school, but for an IT degree, unless you plan on working at Google, it doesn't really matter where you went and experience level will dictate your future compensation. The same is true for an RN. For technical fields in particular, college is not about prestige, its literally about gaining skills.
 
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It must be nice to be able to propose stuff and not have to follow up by actually getting anything done. And I like how he does it on facebook for all the low information voters who will never look beyond that 3 second gif.
 
Yeah yeah, money money money, blah blah blah. There are some things in this world that shouldn't be about money in the slightest. Education is one of them.

nothing is free. the money has to come from somewhere to pay for it. it is a vital and key component to such a bill.
most community college's are already fairly inexpensive. the real cost is if you go to a major university.
 
Good news.

Do whatever it takes to get more people educated. If price was the issue then now the first 2 years it is free.

In Dardania Republic only the 1st year is free.

For good students there are stipendiums and grants. If kids are not good enough to qualify, they should pay for their own careers.
 
For good students there are stipendiums and grants. If kids are not good enough to qualify, they should pay for their own careers.

Some may be less fortunate to be aware of their career potentials in time. It may take longer time within education with them.
 
There are a couple of issues that perhaps our friends in Europe can answer.

How would the application process work? Do you apply before and/or after you get the grades? If before what happens if you don't meet your goals, but since you didn't take out a loan, wouldn't that be free education anyway? Would the government force you to pay for that class only? The whole semester? Or would it be based off of GPA? That's not really helping the student loan cause like Obama said he would.

If you apply after the grades, we as a society would essentially have to get into a verbal contract with the folks who apply. They promise us society that they will get good grades and stay above the threshold. Statically speaking that's almost impossible with our current education system the way it is. Especially in urban poorer communities. Where CC is just about the only choice. Yet free public education sucks. So I'm not sure how well this will turn out.

I know I'm just simplifying this way too much and its going to be a lot more complicated than that, but these are serious questions that people should think about before jumping aboard the bandwagon.
 
Greetings, Fenton. :2wave:

If he's thinking along those lines, how about doing the same thing for trade schools, where young people learn how to be plumbers, electricians, carpenters, etc? We need those people, too, and everyone is not interested in going to college. I don't understand what he meant by "work for it," though. Did he mean apply themselves, or something else?

I have long wondered what happened to trade schools, or as we called them in Jersey - Vo-Tech. I just don't feel they're around anymore. Also - my Dad used to bring his car in to the Vo-Tech to get an oil change at cost! Great way to save money while the students train. Or - does that now violate some labor-laws?
 
nothing is free. the money has to come from somewhere to pay for it. it is a vital and key component to such a bill.
most community college's are already fairly inexpensive. the real cost is if you go to a major university.

Just for future reference. Everyone knows that nothing is free. Everyone knows that if you have a public program that it is paid for with taxes. Everyone knows this.
 
I have long wondered what happened to trade schools, or as we called them in Jersey - Vo-Tech. I just don't feel they're around anymore. Also - my Dad used to bring his car in to the Vo-Tech to get an oil change at cost! Great way to save money while the students train. Or - does that now violate some labor-laws?

Vocational colleges are still common. Particularly in small towns.
 
Vocational colleges are still common. Particularly in small towns.


Many, not all are absolute rip offs.

Vocational schools don't typically vet their students prior to " accepting " them.

They just need payment and you're in.

This can wind up leaving kids with allot of debt and no closer to finding a good job.
 
I have long wondered what happened to trade schools, or as we called them in Jersey - Vo-Tech. I just don't feel they're around anymore. Also - my Dad used to bring his car in to the Vo-Tech to get an oil change at cost! Great way to save money while the students train. Or - does that now violate some labor-laws?

Every single high school in my state has one either within the high school or as a separate facility.

Our local two year tech college changed it's name a few years ago to "community college", but they still offer all the same vocational training that they used to. Support for vo-tech is huge around here.
 
I have long wondered what happened to trade schools, or as we called them in Jersey - Vo-Tech. I just don't feel they're around anymore. Also - my Dad used to bring his car in to the Vo-Tech to get an oil change at cost! Great way to save money while the students train. Or - does that now violate some labor-laws?

They went away in my area in various phases. Part of it was because of the need to push up test scores in the other parts of the curriculum (culinary/food services went first because that was where the barely literate pooled), part of it was budget, and the last nail in the coffin was when the high schools went for a period to block scheduling sort of like college but your schedule rotated so that some weeks were more intense in some subjects than in other weeks with an optional 7th period. Since the remaining vocational classes (automotive and electrician) already used big blocks they interfered with the rotation of the other mandatory subjects like math, English and science. There are still some classes as electives like Shop, but it is not the same as the training programs used to be.
 
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