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Thread: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    You know, the media and the leftist scream and moan anytime anyone makes some profit. Yet, they could not care less about the extremely over priced costs to get a college education in this country. No big surprise, since it is a leftist enclave. $10k, $20k, $50k and up to sit in a class room with a load of other students and be presented course material. That's got to be a the biggest scam going. But, they will get upset about oil companies making six cents on a gallon of fuel (while the government makes $0.18).

    This is just Obama paying off his backers, trying to funnel more of our money to these incredibly over-priced schools. Absolutely disgusting. He should be calling for ways to contain the cost, not trying to find ways to send more of our money to them.
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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    The Government actually increases it's revenue, by spending money on Higher education.
    The increase come from the fact that people with more education earn more and pay more taxes.
    Kind of a win-win.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    They're coming back, and some of them are terrific "alternative routes to the middle class." The Return of Vocational High Schools: More Options or the Kiss of Death? - US News

    "For years, vocational high schools have been seen as a lesser form of schooling – tracking some kids off to work while others were encouraged to go on to college and pursue higher income professions. But things are changing. Vocational high schools are focusing much more on preparing students for higher education." Rethinking vocational high school as a path to college | Marketplace.org

    That "higher education" is often an Associate of Applied Science. To earn one, a student does have to take the basics that every freshman and sophomore college student takes. It's a solid two-year degree.
    The school system next door has one. It is really an alternative school though for baby mommas and discipline cases/underachievers.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by Declan View Post
    They went away in my area in various phases. Part of it was because of the need to push up test scores in the other parts of the curriculum (culinary/food services went first because that was where the barely literate pooled), part of it was budget, and the last nail in the coffin was when the high schools went for a period to block scheduling sort of like college but your schedule rotated so that some weeks were more intense in some subjects than in other weeks with an optional 7th period. Since the remaining vocational classes (automotive and electrician) already used big blocks they interfered with the rotation of the other mandatory subjects like math, English and science. There are still some classes as electives like Shop, but it is not the same as the training programs used to be.
    At the high school level, a lot of times vo training is a waste.

    Most employers really don't want or trust an 18 year old mechanic or carpenter or plumber or electrician, or hair stylist. They want someone older, as do their customers, so few high school vocational school students actually end up with a job in the field they studied. I'm not saying that high school vocational schools is a bad thing, but it's not a fix-all for job training.
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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by longview View Post
    The Government actually increases it's revenue, by spending money on Higher education.
    The increase come from the fact that people with more education earn more and pay more taxes.
    Kind of a win-win.
    In theory, sure.

    But if we train more people for trades, income levels of those trades tends to decline, and we are right back where we started from.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
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    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    At the high school level, a lot of times vo training is a waste.

    Most employers really don't want or trust an 18 year old mechanic or carpenter or plumber or electrician, or hair stylist. They want someone older, as do their customers, so few high school vocational school students actually end up with a job in the field they studied. I'm not saying that high school vocational schools is a bad thing, but it's not a fix-all for job training.
    In our area it was a good way for them the graduate and then apprentice under a plumber/carpenter/electrician/mechanic. I don't care how old my mechanic is as long as he fixes what needs fixing. My understanding is that the carpentry program had a very high placement rate within the industry when it was operating.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by Declan View Post
    The school system next door has one. It is really an alternative school though for baby mommas and discipline cases/underachievers.
    We have a program such as this in my community--an accelerated completion program that helps at-risk students to finish high school. And it's paired with an early childhood development program, meaning that students interested in this have the opportunity to develop their skills by watching the babies while the baby mamas are doing the necessary academic work.

    My community has also developed other high schools, one for those interested in criminal justice, another for those interested in health/human sciences, and yet another that targets students who are both extremely promising and mature academically and also financially disadvantaged, primarily because of minority-group status. These students take courses at the community college, and I've seen one Hispanic female who was accepted into the major university of her choice, free ride, at just-turned 16.

    The point is that there are all sorts of creative, proactive programs being developed and succeeding.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    We have a program such as this in my community--an accelerated completion program that helps at-risk students to finish high school. And it's paired with an early childhood development program, meaning that students interested in this have the opportunity to develop their skills by watching the babies while the baby mamas are doing the necessary academic work.

    My community has also developed other high schools, one for those interested in criminal justice, another for those interested in health/human sciences, and yet another that targets students who are both extremely promising and mature academically and also financially disadvantaged, primarily because of minority-group status. These students take courses at the community college, and I've seen one Hispanic female who was accepted into the major university of her choice, free ride, at just-turned 16.

    The point is that there are all sorts of creative, proactive programs being developed and succeeding.
    The math-science magnet school in our system has 99-100% college acceptance rate depending on whether or not a couple people opt for the military instead. I like the direction of specialty schools. I really don't care if someone can answer jeopardy questions as long as they have a realistic chance at good opportunity when they walk out the door. I just don't pretend that they are anything other than what they are. Some kids do well academically and some do not.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    In theory, sure.

    But if we train more people for trades, income levels of those trades tends to decline, and we are right back where we started from.
    History has not shown that, Better educated people have more choices than just what they are trained in.
    A degree opens up other opportunities.
    Part of the equation (which most schools do not do) is industry feedback.
    I hope they limit this to only non-profit community colleges.

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    Re: Obama Proposes 2 Years of Free Community College

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    You know, the media and the leftist scream and moan anytime anyone makes some profit. Yet, they could not care less about the extremely over priced costs to get a college education in this country. No big surprise, since it is a leftist enclave. $10k, $20k, $50k and up to sit in a class room with a load of other students and be presented course material. That's got to be a the biggest scam going. But, they will get upset about oil companies making six cents on a gallon of fuel (while the government makes $0.18).

    This is just Obama paying off his backers, trying to funnel more of our money to these incredibly over-priced schools. Absolutely disgusting. He should be calling for ways to contain the cost, not trying to find ways to send more of our money to them.
    That's not true. Everybody I know (on the left and right) thinks higher education costs are too damn high.
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