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Thread: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

  1. #661
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    I did not have any issue with her, as she never unethically acted on her stated opposition to my social group (conservative Christians).

    Yes, she did openly identify as a lesbian and and an atheist. Yes, she informed me directly that she had a dim view of the social goals of conservative Christians and the place of conservative religion in America. Yes, she knew I was a conservative Christian (pro life bumper sticker on my car, I also periodically requested vacation time to go to church services during the week, took off for Good Friday etc.).

    So, she might have decided that she did not like me personally and could have decided to discriminate against me. Yes, I could have went to HR, but I dont favor turning people in for what they "might" decide and "could" do. It is simply against basic fairness and wastes time.
    So you had nothing to report. Of course it's not black and white but 'dim view' is not the same as clearly saying you believe they are perverts and dirty. Her stated opinion was of an agenda, not you personally. Politics is difficult to keep completely out of the workplace and I think that's handled on a incident by incident basis by HR. Political affiliation isnt a protected class.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  2. #662
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    your supervisor has a pro life bumper sticker on her car
    you received sick leave so you could get an abortion
    and then believed you were retaliated against by that pro life supervisor
    does the supervisor now get terminated because she dared 'publish' her pro life moral belief on her automobile, which is located in the employer's parking lot?
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Of course it's not black and white but 'dim view' is not the same as clearly saying you believe they are perverts and dirty. Her stated opinion was of an agenda, not you personally. .
    She voiced a personal opinion that conservative Christianity in particular, and conservative religion in general was "anti democratic" (among other things). What discriminatory actions "might" somebody take against an individual deemed to be affiliated with such a group?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Political affiliation isnt a protected class.
    No, but my religion is a protected class. In addition, identification as a conservative christians might also be a protected social group.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    So you had nothing to report.
    Very true, I had nothing to report. That is why I never thought about going to HR. Evidently, the gays working in Atlanta Fire Department also have "nothing to report". Rather, they only have potential concerns (might, could), just like I did.
    Last edited by Cryptic; 01-12-15 at 03:45 PM.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    She voiced a personal opinion that conservative Christianity in particular, and conservative religion in general was "anti democratic" (among other things). What discriminatory actions "might" somebody take against an individual deemed to be affiliated with such a group?

    No, but my religion is a protected class. In addition, identification as a conservative christians might also be a protected social group.

    Very true, I had nothing to report. That is why I never thought about going to HR. Evidently, the gays working in Atlanta Fire Department also have "nothing to report". Rather, they only have potential concerns (might, could), just like I did.
    We all have to deal with differing opinions at work. She didnt say you were dirty or a pervert. There is spectrum here....within and outside of illegal discrimination. Someone else with your concerns may have mentioned it to HR. Not necessarily a report, a concern. Because if you were actually concerned, then maybe others were too. If she said those things to you I think she was behaving improperly in her capacity as a supervisor.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    If she said those things to you I think she was behaving improperly in her capacity as a supervisor.
    I think you have a point here, it was probably was inappropriate.

    At the same time, part of our work there was tracking social trends and interests. Thus, it was more culturally permissable in that office to openly voice one's own opinions on a variety of political matters- espescially if one favored the dominate progressive views.

    At the end of the day though, complaints from either side of the socio political spectrum should be based on "dids", not "coulds" and "mights".

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    I think you have a point here, it was probably was inappropriate.

    At the same time, part of our work there was tracking social trends and interests. Thus, it was more culturally permissable in that office to openly voice one's own opinions on a variety of political matters- espescially if one favored the dominate progressive views.

    At the end of the day though, complaints from either side of the socio political spectrum should be based on "dids", not "coulds" and "mights".
    In some cases, if you wait until they take action and you never report or document anything, you have no basis to fight for a missed promotion or unfair termination. That's why things that establish a pattern are important. I dont know if only this man's words in a book are enough to terminate him but we dont know if there was a pattern.

    And all opinions are not equal, at least not under our legal system. Blatant racists expressing the same level of disregard and prejudice as what the fire chief wrote would be considered differently, at least I think so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  7. #667
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    If he had discriminated in the past, I am sure it would have been revealed by now.
    That's what I think as well.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    his book only provided basis to those who could show evidence of actual bias
    which causes me to question why the city does not reveal exactly what the basis was for his termination
    in fact, the city was pissed it was unable to conceal the nature of its unpaid suspension of the fire chief because he disclosed it in church. he dared mention what was being inflicted upon him by the city while it was not paying him any wage
    The Mayor is all over the place with his comments. I don't understand why he doesn't say exactly why he was terminated. Hell, if he was terminate for insubordination (they said don't give out book and he did), that's understandable. If there was discrimination in the workplace and he caused it, okay. If they're pissed because he mentioned the City in his book, yes. But he's flailing about and giving multiple answers without saying why he did it (causing all the assumptions in this thread).
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    your supervisor has a pro life bumper sticker on her car
    you received sick leave so you could get an abortion
    and then believed you were retaliated against by that pro life supervisor
    does the supervisor now get terminated because she dared 'publish' her pro life moral belief on her automobile, which is located in the employer's parking lot?
    Very good analogy. And actually could be close to what happened here. But that would also assume that pro-life people are part of a protected class and they aren't. The end result (hostile workplace) is the same, but the players aren't (protected versus unprotected class). I tried to do something similar a few times in this thread but I think this is a great analogy.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Very good analogy. And actually could be close to what happened here. But that would also assume that pro-life people are part of a protected class and they aren't. The end result (hostile workplace) is the same, but the players aren't (protected versus unprotected class). I tried to do something similar a few times in this thread but I think this is a great analogy.
    actually, it was Cryptic in post #659 who sparked the thought with his mention of the pro life sticker
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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