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Thread: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

  1. #571
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) good thats step one, Bladdy blah blah blah
    Anyway, I don't have to do anything. I already did prove you made up a straw man, and fake analogy. Why must I do it again? I think it would serve you well to visit the internet and actually look up how to spot a logical fallacy, and how to make proper analogies. Logical fallacies are sometimes hard to spot or notice, it's true, trust me. I do a pretty good job of avoiding them, but I've had years to perfect my craft, however, I still have trouble with false dichotomy or excluded middle from time to time, and I've been called out on it on more than one occasion. Of course our natural instinct on a adversarial message board is to deny the fallacy exists, I get it, I do it too, and I want to argue that the one pointing it out is just plain wrong, however on the few occasion I have been called out, I eventually acknowledge publicly that I was wrong, and that the person pointing it out was correct. That being said, I do often look for another way to argue my point as I don't like losing debates. The difference between you and me (And there are many but this once) is that I have gone on record as publicly conceding defeat in debates. Unlike many here at DP, I actually respect a good counter argument. The problem you have is that you do not recognize opinion as opinion. Even a judge, or the SCOTUS is really just opinion. It's rare, VERY rare that we have incontrovertible facts at our disposal during a debate. The "fact" that you do not know this and continually ask for factual proof is mind glowingly stunning. You display an utter lack of understanding of how to frame an argument based on opinion as opinion backed by evidence that would reasonably lead an observer to agree with you. That is what debate is all about, or we wouldn't be debating the subject matter. How you do not know this is curious, and your posts often have me begging the question about you as a person rather than the sustenance of your argument.

    But hey, like I said, continue on, I have no oversized ego to bruise, and you of all people couldn't get under my skin. I'll let my posts speak for themselves, and others that even care to opine, may do so based off of my actual arguments, not your insinuations.

    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
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  2. #572
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    In my last discrimination seminar (I thought it was a requirement all managers do this yearly, maybe thats just my company) it was drilled into my head that managers are under a lot more scrutiny due to the fact that they 1. represent the company to the rank and file and 2. can use the weight of the company in personal decisions.
    Many companies have mandatory seminars and online trainings that employees must take, be signed off on, to help protect the company from different types of workplace harassment, security, sensitivity, discrimination, intellectual property retention, what you can say to the press, etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  3. #573
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    1.)Anyway, I don't have to do anything.
    2.)I already did prove you made up a straw man, and fake analogy. Why must I do it again? I think it would serve you well to visit the internet and actually look up how to spot a logical fallacy, and how to make proper analogies. Logical fallacies are sometimes hard to spot or notice, it's true, trust me. I do a pretty good job of avoiding them, but I've had years to perfect my craft, however, I still have trouble with false dichotomy or excluded middle from time to time, and I've been called out on it on more than one occasion. Of course our natural instinct on a adversarial message board is to deny the fallacy exists, I get it, I do it too, and I want to argue that the one pointing it out is just plain wrong, however on the few occasion I have been called out, I eventually acknowledge publicly that I was wrong, and that the person pointing it out was correct. That being said, I do often look for another way to argue my point as I don't like losing debates. The difference between you and me (And there are many but this once) is that I have gone on record as publicly conceding defeat in debates. Unlike many here at DP, I actually respect a good counter argument. The problem you have is that you do not recognize opinion as opinion. Even a judge, or the SCOTUS is really just opinion. It's rare, VERY rare that we have incontrovertible facts at our disposal during a debate. The "fact" that you do not know this and continually ask for factual proof is mind glowingly stunning. You display an utter lack of understanding of how to frame an argument based on opinion as opinion backed by evidence that would reasonably lead an observer to agree with you. That is what debate is all about, or we wouldn't be debating the subject matter. How you do not know this is curious, and your posts often have me begging the question about you as a person rather than the sustenance of your argument.

    But hey, like I said, continue on, I have no oversized ego to bruise, and you of all people couldn't get under my skin. I'll let my posts speak for themselves, and others that even care to opine, may do so based off of my actual arguments, not your insinuations.

    Tim-
    translation: you cant, thats what i thought
    just another post about me with failed insults and nothign about the topic, plese stay on topic, thanks
    also thats a long post to simply deflect from your post being defeated
    anyway thanks for proving it, let me know when you can back up any of the false claims you made and stay on topic. I posted ZERO strawmen. If you disagree with the facts prove them wrong, please and thank you.

    your post fails and facts win again
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  4. #574
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Many companies have mandatory seminars and online trainings that employees must take, be signed off on, to help protect the company from different types of workplace harassment, security, sensitivity, discrimination, intellectual property retention, what you can say to the press, etc.
    I know, its amazing how many people don't get this obvious fact and chalk it up to religious discrimination for some reason I have yet to fathom.

  5. #575
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    I know, its amazing how many people don't get this obvious fact and chalk it up to religious discrimination for some reason I have yet to fathom.
    He wrote the book. He is allowed to do that. He handed it out. Why is that against the rules? Did he do it under the auspices of the city? Or did he do it on his own?
    The Crowd is not the sum of its parts.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by stonewall50 View Post
    He wrote the book. He is allowed to do that. He handed it out. Why is that against the rules? Did he do it under the auspices of the city? Or did he do it on his own?
    Because it declares a class of people which HR probably has a policy about (I dont know, but sexual orientation is becoming more and more a protected status by HR departments every day, so I think its a safe assumption that the city HR dept has it covered) to be evil or immoral. This creates a hostile or uncomfortable workplace environment.

    Thats really all there is to it in this case as far as I can see and its pretty cut and dry.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    I know, its amazing how many people don't get this obvious fact and chalk it up to religious discrimination for some reason I have yet to fathom.
    well its not that many, its like a handful. At least here it is.
    But you are right its still amazing that there are that many.
    Whats not amazing though is after 500+ posts theres not one of those posts that can support that false claim with anythign factual.

    unless more comes out nothing will change

    so far based on all the articles posted here and that ive read its ZERO surprise this guy was fired. He was a complete moron on this topic to think there would be no consequences for his ACTIONS. Im actually surprised he was suspended for a month.. If i did somethign that stupid at work i would expect to last a week and i would expect a straight termination . . no suspension prior.
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by stonewall50 View Post
    1.)He wrote the book. He is allowed to do that.
    2.) He handed it out.
    3.) Why is that against the rules?
    4.) Did he do it under the auspices of the city? Or did he do it on his own?
    1.) correct, he is allowed to right a book
    2.) correct he can do that
    3.) thats not against the rules
    4.) no
    5.) yes
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  9. #579
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by stonewall50 View Post
    He wrote the book. He is allowed to do that. He handed it out. Why is that against the rules? Did he do it under the auspices of the city? Or did he do it on his own?
    Why did several people complain to the union? Since they got the union involved, it's very possible it was at work or on work time.

    If someone I worked with, manager or not, handed me a book *they wrote* with blatant racist or anti-feminist (women belong in the home!), or hate speech of any kind in it, I would be offended, may feel that my job was threatened. I would probably bring it to their superior's attention.

    Because 'hate' and 'ignorance' are very strong identifiers about someone's personality....it's easy to believe that it would affect their views...and actions like promotion, firing, etc...at work.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  10. #580
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    The other workers, more than one, complained to the union.
    Yes, that's what I saw. I didn't see anywhere that the people who actually got the books were the ones who complained either, unless I missed that somewhere.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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