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Thread: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

  1. #521
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    First, then why did you claim he DIDN'T say that?
    because you were talking about multiple things one of which was in the book.

    Second, there is a difference between stating as a religious person you try to glorify god in all that you do....and stating that your first priority as a professional is to cultivate a culture that glorifies him.


    The first is talking about you personally and your own actions. The second, talking about cultivating a CULTURE, suggests your acting on your environment and the things around you. That is different.
    they go hand in hand and that still is no reason to fire someone.

    However, again I note...there's a difference in saying "I think it's okay that he said it" and denying he said it at all, which you did initially.
    I was commenting about what you said was in his book. that he was saying gays were equal to this or that. he didn't say that at all.


    Again, stop ignorantly claiming your opinion and guesses as if they're undisputable facts. They're not. There are a number of official reasons given by the city as to why he was terminated; none were "expressing his religious beliefs".
    all the reasons they gave were bunk. there was no issue with this person at all till a homosexual didn't like the fact that he did a study book for his church.
    so far there are no official reasons given that hold any tangible argument. the only thing is that a city council member who is openly gay didn't like what he wrote in his study book.

    to bad for him that study book is protected by federal laws. as well as the Chiefs religious views.


    I haven't seen where they've definitively claimed he has violated discrimination laws, and that claim is not seemingly the basis of their termination of him.


    If HE is alledging that they terminated him due to discrimination its on him to prove that, as discrimination is an affirmative defense.
    how is it not? it all goes back to the book that he wrote.

    The mayor’s office opened an investigation into Cochran’s conduct after employees shared concerns over the book’s contents, city spokeswoman Anne Torres said in November. At the time, Torres said “there are a number of passages in the book that directly conflict with the city’s nondiscrimination policies.”

    unless he was enforcing those views at work which there is no evidence that he was this is a bogus investigation.

    Chief Cochran also failed to notify me, as Mayor and Chief Executive of the City of Atlanta and his employer, of his plans to publish the book and its inflammatory content.

    Hogwash.

    Mayor: City separating with Atlanta fire chief | www.wsbtv.com

    he gave the mayor a copy of the book a year ago.


    I hope he sues the city for mega bucks. religious discrimination is against the law. He got permission to write the book and the mayor knows it.


    Prove a negative. That makes sense.
    Your making the claim it is up to you to back that up or prove he is lying.

    He is the one making the claim that an action DID take place. He is the one alledging that his termination was due to fraudulent reasons. He needs to provide the proof that he did what they claim he did not. If he did, he should be able to provide evidence of it either through his own means or via legal means in obtaining their records.
    His only mistake was not getting it in writing. always get it in writing.
    However I see no reason for him to lie and everything for the mayor to do what he did.

    there is a suit coming and the city is in major trouble.

  2. #522
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    Effective leadership is as much about your subordinates' perception of you as it is about how you conduct yourself. In this case, the chief created a situation which forced his subordinates to question his ability to lead them effectively without prejudice, he created a hostile work environment, and brought his office copious amounts of bad press to boot. It doesn't matter whether he actually has or would discriminate against homosexuals; what matters is that his subordinates lost confidence in his leadership on this issue.
    Was that demonstrated, or are you just saying that?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  3. #523
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    1.) Oh I am fully aware of you M.O. cupcake.. factually this, factually that, translation this, translation that..

    here's what you said exactly.

    2.)First lets deal with the strawman. By invoking hyperbole, you intentionally lead the observer to assume that what you're saying is so vile that it couldn't possibly be allowed in a work place environment, thus, setting up a strawman, and knocking it down - HOWEVER, (And here's the analogy part, you paying attention yet) notwithstanding your attempt to equate (Which is another way to say analogous) vile niggers - Jews burning - Dirty black people - "fags" unleashing plagues - and filthy Christian infidels deserving to be killed was absurd, not even remotely analogous to this situation, but you attempted to present it anyway.

    I "factually" called you out on it, ONLY because you were calling out other posters for doing the same thing, the only difference is, that most of their analogies were at least close. TRANSLATION: You did exactly the same thing that you accused others of doing.

    Got it now? Was it clear enough and factually consistent with the evidence? Was I able to translate your words into context with the proper syntax associated with the English language, well enough to form a reasonable understanding of what you were saying in printed word? Assuming I did translate correctly, how on Earth can you argue that you did not present a stawman argument, or a phony analogy that was no analogy at all?? Please do try though, I as always when dealing with you, could use the laugh.

    Tim-
    1.) yep you are correct i point out facts all the time
    2.) thank you for reposting it and again n no matter how you try to twist by DEFINITION its not a strawman. . .I made a request for people to do . . . .i made no "false argument"
    everything you claimed that i said besides my Actual qoute i did not, YOU assumed it and invented it.
    nobody honest, educated an objective will ever by what you MADE UP on top of my post lol
    YOU dont get to decided what i "really" mean and invent hidden definiton, that the BS you made up in your own head that was NEVER said as proven my qoute.


    WOW nothing like totally owning your own post.
    thank you for proving i didn't post any strawman.

    your post fails, loses and gets destroyed and as always facts win again.
    Your false claims are 0 and lifetime against me and facts.

    fact remains by definition i made ZERO strawman

    also thank you for calling me out totally embarrassing your own false claim, that was awesome! Please continue your lie and make up some more stuff i never said, I can wait i love it!
    Last edited by AGENT J; 01-08-15 at 07:55 PM.
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    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    This really isn't rocket surgery. If the fire chief had handed out anti-woman, anti-minority or antisemitic literature to his employees this thread would have fizzled out by page three after attracting the usual libertarians.
    exactly because the hatred and bigotry against them isnt as currently charged and vile as the hatred against "da gays"
    those battles are over so SOME people dont get so emotionally charged by thier bigotry and or want of not supporting equal rights

    its hilarious watching the super vast minority and handful of posters claim this is MAGICALLY different . . . its transparent and pure entertainment for the rest of posters

    if the articles are true with no more back ground and i did somethign this retarded at my work of course i would expect to get fired and rightfully so.
    This space is currently owned by The Great Winchester, stay tuned for future messages!
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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Was he in a position to hire, and did he discriminate against homosexuals when hiring or evaluating their performance? That's where this should all lie, in the execution. I'm afraid that if we keep pushing these issues, we're going to end up with essentially some form of thought control, reeducation camps for those who don't agree with whatever we're supposed to agree with, and anyone expressing anything anywhere else (work place or private) can be punished for doing so.
    They call it “sensitivity training”. In fact, it's even mentioned in one of the articles that's been posted so far…

    The mayor went on to inform the public that Cochran had been suspended without pay and was ordered to complete a sensitivity training class.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Was that demonstrated, or are you just saying that?
    It was demonstrated two months ago. His suspension without pay in November of last year was triggered by a number of complaints to the firefighters union, mayor's office, and city council by his subordinates who received the book in the workplace. The union noted that they had fielded a number communications from gay firefighters who were concerned about retaliation or discrimination if they were outed.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    It was demonstrated two months ago. His suspension without pay in November of last year was triggered by a number of complaints to the firefighters union, mayor's office, and city council by his subordinates who received the book in the workplace.
    Quantify that.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Quantify that.
    Those communications are confidential and the exact number has not been publicized.

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    Those communications are confidential and the exact number has not been publicized.
    So we don't really know. We have a "number" but no value and no statistics to prove that performance had been evaluated and had a marked and resolvable drop due to this incident.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Atlanta Ousts Fire Chief Who Has Antigay Views

    The mayor has designs on higher office after this term. His Christian constituents will remember this. The fire cheif is a Christian and wrote the book based on his beliefs. He gave copies to those who asked for them. This is the mayor bowing to pressure from a group that represents 3% of the population. Obama claims to be a Christian. This is PC run amuck. Truly disappointing to see how many here think this is a good idea. Someday the idea you can not express may be yours. Think back on this moment then. When you get fired for expressing your belief in AGW (a religion) don't expect sympathy. I don't necessarily agree with the cheif's views, but they are his to hold and did not interfer with his job performance. They did, after all, put out many fires that were... uh... flaming.

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