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Thread: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

  1. #111
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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Now that you mention it, she could have got the message from you or someone like you. How would you feel if you were the one who told her she would be safer carrying a gun in her purse at Walmart or sold that mother the AR-15 that killed her and all those children in Sandy Hook? Would you be sorry?
    Had she got the message from me, she would have also gotten the message to carry in a holster and to train regularly.

    Or maybe she read any of the numerous accounts of unarmed people that were murdered and...sunovagun...no cops were there to protect them. Or perhaps she read the numerous reports of armed citizens defending themselves. Regardless of her reasoning...the decision to own a firearm and carry a firearm was not erroneous...it was her manner in which she chose to do so. Sometimes people do stupid things, even with valuable tools. This appears to be one of those cases.

    By all means...keep dancing in her blood as you try to promote your inane cause fueled by your hatred and bias. Tell me...who do you blame when someone gets in an auto accident while texting? Do you have a hard on for Apple? Maybe Motorola? What about when they kill someone drinking and driving...hey...the common thread IS cars after all. SO...Chevy? Ford? Oh...wait...I know...the United Auto Workers.

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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Statistically, the gun you own is more likely to kill or injure you or a loved one than be used for protection.



    Guns in the Home and Risk of a Violent Death in the Home: Findings from a National Study
    those studies have been thoroughly debunked. most of them included a "gun in the home" as one where an intruder or murderer brought the gun to the home and shot an occupant. IN one well known study it was that case in 431/436 of the incidents included in the study. its a tautology that if there is no gun present no one will be shot. suicide is a worthless statistic because countries with no guns have higher suicide rates than well armed America.


    No one for a second believes your anti gun rants are based on a public safety issue. there is an obvious fact on this board-EVERY gun hater is a far lefty. its clear that the perceived politics of gun owners is what causes gun control to be an almost entirely far left agenda item



  3. #113
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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Statistically, the gun you own is more likely to kill or injure you or a loved one than be used for protection.



    Guns in the Home and Risk of a Violent Death in the Home: Findings from a National Study
    Statistically that's not the only reason to own a weapon...it doesn't count the number of times that a weapon was used to defend a person from serious injury, or rape, etc.

    Just a month after the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary, President Obama called for an assessment of the existing research on gun violence and recommendations for more studies. Now, that assessment is out, and it delves deeply into what research shows us about why gun violence happens in this country – and also into how well the defensive use of guns work.

    Citing four separate studies between 1988-2004, the assessment from the Institute of Medicine and the National Research Council says crime victims who use guns in self-defense have consistently lower injury rates than victims who use other strategies to protect themselves (other strategies include stalling, calling the police or using weapons such as knives or baseball bats).
    In the most recent of those studies, Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck and University of New Haven professor of criminal justice Jongyeon Tark, examined whether the defensive use of guns resulted in property loss, minor injury to a victim, or serious injury. Kleck and Tark found that using a gun reduced the risk of all three, and that injury resulted from self-protection with a gun in only 10 percent of cases.
    Now.. add to that the use of firearms for hunting purposes, for collecting, for target practice and for competitive shooting... and just plain old fashioned fun?

    Lot more reasons to own one than to not own one.

  4. #114
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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    This is one of those things that just goes to prove, you can't make laws to account for every single instance of stupidity.

    Tragic accident and I really feel for the kid, to know you shot your own mom... just horrific.

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    Re: Mom Shot, Killed By 2-Year-Old Son at Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    What? I don't think you understand what the "chamber" of a gun is. Not having a round in the chamber doesn't mean you don't have any bullets.
    The point of carrying a gun, is to be able to react to a threat immediately. If the weapon isn't locked and loaded, the time it takes to lock and load can inhibit your ability to respond to a threat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  6. #116
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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    Sure.. she could have decided to put a lock on the purse, and then.. when she was mugged in the parking lot.. she is raped and killed in front of her 2 year old because she could get the gun out in time.

    Pointing out.. there are tradeoffs in carrying a weapon for self defense. It has to be accessible, it has to be able to be fired without tremendous effort.. like fumbling with a difficult safety, or racking a round into the chamber. Sometimes fractions of seconds count... and it has to be secure from being taken from you by someone else either a perp or a toddler.

    If everytime something happened with a child.. it was automatically the parents fault for being irresponsible... every parent would be considered irresponsible.

    .


    We're not talking about every time here. This thread is about this one, specific, case. And in this case it looks like the mother who left her unsecured gun in her purse in a shopping basket with a 2-year old child is responsible for her own death.

    Who else would you like to blame?


    This was not an accident. The lady in this story is dead because she failed to secure her gun.
    Last edited by shrubnose; 12-31-14 at 01:18 PM.

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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    True. Perhaps she was a CIA agent and had someone after her. Otherwise she was a fool to think she needed to carry a gun in her purse while shopping with her children at a Walmart. I wonder where she got that idea?
    Do you expect anyone to believe you honestly subscribe to that tripe?

  8. #118
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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I wouldn't say that this woman was generally irresponsible. She was simply irresponsible at that moment and THAT is why I wanted to discuss firearm safety basics in this thread. Too often we get comfortable with the things we do every day and when we get too casual about our safety (and, as a result, the safety of those around us) accidents can turn tragic.

    From what I've read this woman was using a new rig but also the type of rig she'd be familiar with under different circumstances. Her comfort with a purse overrode her comfort with daily carry and the results were catastrophic.

    This isn't about bashing people who carry or even people who make mistakes. It's simply a stark reminder of why you need to keep your head in the game the whole time you're playing.
    Of course she was irresponsible. She had a loaded weapon in her purse and left her purse where her son could get to it.

    In what way shape or form was she a responsible gun owner?

    Was it tragic for her and all involved, hell yes.

    But if we act like she was not irresponsible - it is open season on all gun owners.

    The fact that she was irresponsible with her gun around her children is just FITH.

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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    I'm in favor of more gun control laws and more gun safety measures, as many of you know. But about the only thing though that could have helped in this case was trigger locks, I'm thinking.
    In Heller, the Supreme Court already ruled that being forced to keep the gun in an unready state defeats practical use of the gun and thus violates the 2nd Amendment.

    Try again.

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    Re: Toddler shoots and kills mother in Hayden Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    True. Perhaps she was a CIA agent and had someone after her. Otherwise she was a fool to think she needed to carry a gun in her purse while shopping with her children at a Walmart. I wonder where she got that idea?
    If she had someone after her, why would she leave her gun unattended with her kids in tow. If I had a CCP for my protection, and I was carrying it in a purse, it would be in a crossbody purse that I had easy access to it - and I had control of my weapon.

    To see this as any less than the act of someone who was irresponsible with her firearm is an affront to all the responsible gun owners (that are in the vast majority).

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