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Thread: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group [W:22, 100]

  1. #101
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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    I disagree. The "European American rights component" should have been a red flag to Scalise that the group was strange. Duke also founded the National Association for the Advancement of White People.

    Speaking to a strange group (in this case, a white ethnocentric one) does not make him a racist- anymore than Obama befriending Nations of Islam types (black ethnocentrics) automatically makes him a racist.
    That's because you have the context of a WP group to focus "European American" as being similar to "African American", instead of "European American" being "Europe and America". It's easy to see the red flags in hindsight, not so easy to see them without that perspective.
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by smb View Post
    A name like David Duke is self-explanatory for anyone who had paid attention to politics in the last two decades and especially LA politics. If he didn't know the group was founded and ran by David Duke he should have known.
    That's why I questioned the wisdom of accepting a speaking engagement without doing the legwork to find out who they were. Most people don't have clue what that group was until this issue popped up. Scalise most certainly should have vetted the org. but to assume that he knew who he was speaking to is creating a motivation that you shouldn't assume exists. Pretty much this whole issue is nothing more than an effort by liberals to be able to point to conservatives and say "See, they are all racists!!", then run circles and congratulate each other for being able to assign to another person a trait that you can't prove exists except by virtue of your own desire for it to exist (that's called "bigotry" in case you missed it).
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

  3. #103
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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Mornin' MGOP.
    The reason the Conservatives are making a hubbub about it is due to Scalise not being Conservative enough. The conservatives wanted Tom Graves Georgia Republican as the Whip.
    This!

    If you are right, then the blog that this originated from was indeed Hard-Right Conservative: Stormfront perhaps, or libertarian and in hindsight it was probably libertarian in nature anyway. Does anyone know for sure what blog this originated from?
    There's no greater irony than a Trump supporter pointing out hypocrisy; Unless it's Trump himself.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    That's because you have the context of a WP group to focus "European American" as being similar to "African American", instead of "European American" being "Europe and America". It's easy to see the red flags in hindsight, not so easy to see them without that perspective.
    I see your point- and I think confusion from somebody not involved in poltics such as a businessman- espescially an immigrant, or a native from say, Portland Oregon, would be far more understandable.

    Scalise, however, is not only a politician, but he is from the South. As such, the contention that he would not realize that a group named the "European American Rights Orgainization" in NOLA could very well be a white ethnocentric group is a stretch.

    It would be similar to a black politician from Chicago saying: "Nations of Islam? Aw shucks, I thought they were you know.... a club presenting the cultures of Islamic nations like Senegal, Chad and Jordan...."

    Making a single speech to either a white ethnocentric group, or being briefly assosciated with a black ethnocentrist, however, does not make automatically make one a racist. In short, Scalise is no more automatically a racist than Obama is.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by ModerateGOP View Post
    This!

    If you are right, then the blog that this originated from was indeed Hard-Right Conservative: Stormfront perhaps, or libertarian and in hindsight it was probably libertarian in nature anyway. Does anyone know for sure what blog this originated from?


    I was thinking Hard core conservatives.....like Santorum and their bunch. Some Tea Partiers not libertarians. As they are not happy with the Leadership. McCarthy is From California and is Moderate like Scalise too.

    Then there is Boehner.

    I was hoping LMR would be in.....he is from Louisiana and can give us the straight dope.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    My take....

    Is it a good look that he talked to that group? No, not at all. It's definitely not a good look for him, or for Republicans in general.

    That said...

    It was smart on his part to simply own up to the fact he spoke with them from the onset. He also claims that he had not looked significantly into what or who the group was before speaking at the meeting in question.

    While it's absolutely possible he's lying, there's little reason to just assume that he is. The meeting in question took place in 2002. The group was created only two years before that, and had gone by an entirely seperate name for it's first two years of life (NO FEAR). All reports from seem to indicate that Scalises statements and discussions at said meeting were about rather benign, standard, Republican talking points regarding welfare programs and things like affirmative action. While people may have varying views on those, and people may like to assume they're Professor X and can read peoples minds, there's nothing inherently racist or vile in terms of having views that affirmative action is not a good program or that we need to cut back on federal welfare spending. Nothing that's been reported seems to suggest this politician was actually articulating or arguing for inherently white supremicist/white nationalist policy/stances/statements. Nor does he have any seeming history of racially questionable statements or actions, outside of the standard pathetic attempts by some hyper partisan liberals to label basic Republican policy beliefs as "racist". There also, at this point, doesn't seem to be some kind of ongoing involvement with this group outside of this particular event.

    So does this look bad? Yes. Would it be bad if he knew that this was a white nationalist or supremicist group and went to speak with them anyways? Yes. Would it have been bad if he tried to cover it up? Yes. If it comes out that he's had an ongoing working relationship with that group for multiple years would it be bad? Yes.

    But at this moment I'm not seeing anything to get horribly worked up about with where this story currently is. It was discovered he was at said event. He admitted he was at said event. He gave a plausible claim that he didn't realize the groups makeup and ultimately goals at the time; something that seems at least possible given various facts. Nothing he reported to have said or endorsed was inherently a racist or supremcisist/nationalist type of notion, and he's had no seeming continued consistent contact with the group.

    Does it look bad? Yes. Does it probably make it smarter politically to go for another whip at this time? Absolutely. But given all the facts that have came out thus far, to me this is kind of a shoulder shrug in terms of some kind of thing to get worked up about in terms of him personally, the party, or him being in congress.
    Very well said!

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    I am not ready to lynch the Congressman in the court of public opinion just yet. he says he was unaware that this was a white supremacist group when he spoke there. I will take his word for it.
    I'm with you, particularly given the length of time since this happened and the fact that the politician in question has not repeated this kind of activity again. In fact it appears until the blogger in Louisiana aired these allegations a few days ago, Scalise still did not know the group was associated with David Duke and like minded racist. Seems hard to believe, but his press agent was on TV last night making a pretty good case for the fact that back when this occurred, Scalise was speaking to any and every group he could book an appearance in front of. In the absence of anything else and given the preponderance of charges of racism in our race obsessed culture? I'm going to pass on joining the mob of torch wielding villagers on this one.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    This man gave a speech to a group 12 years ago and people are calling for him to step down.

    Charlie Rangel is as dirty as they come and he is acceptable.

    There is a disconnect here as to what issues are important.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    That's why I questioned the wisdom of accepting a speaking engagement without doing the legwork to find out who they were. Most people don't have clue what that group was until this issue popped up. Scalise most certainly should have vetted the org. but to assume that he knew who he was speaking to is creating a motivation that you shouldn't assume exists. Pretty much this whole issue is nothing more than an effort by liberals to be able to point to conservatives and say "See, they are all racists!!", then run circles and congratulate each other for being able to assign to another person a trait that you can't prove exists except by virtue of your own desire for it to exist (that's called "bigotry" in case you missed it).
    I disagree with you completely on the motivation. I do not know if Scalise is a racist or not. It is not my motivation nor the motivation of any other liberal I know to prove that. What this is an example of tone deafness. I do not believe most or even a significant number of those in the conservative movement are racists. I do believe that most racist groups identify with the conservative movement. Because many of the racist groups in this country seek or believe they are tied to the conservative movement I think it is incumbent on the conservative movement to much more attune to racism and racist concerns then liberal groups. It is not fair but it is reality. The modern conservative movement has, for reasons unbeknownst to me, adopted an almost systemic policy of deafness to racial issues. It seems that if they walk and talk as if racial issues don't exist they won't exist. That is not reality. What then happens is the conservative movement gets tagged fairly or unfairly with the racist tag. Things like going to a group to be a speaker and not first checking to see if their a racist organization is case and point. I have a problem with Scalise not showing due diligence and being tone deaf to racial politics...not what any of us liberal or conservative need in the leadership of our country.

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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by ModerateGOP View Post
    Read more: Steve Scalise office: Likely he spoke to white supremacist group - POLITICO

    Well, the man who many have been looking towards as the future of the Republican Party and quite possibly a future President (See house of cards TV Show) seems to have more than a few skeletons in his closet. Not sure about the "rumor" however... It's a very interesting ripple.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    Prove that Barack Obama embraces hate groups. You may not use a right-wing rag to do it. Use a credible objective journalistic source.

    Ga'head.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    What about Nation of Islam activists?
    Obama’s Chicago Hate Group Connection | FrontPage Magazine

    Who support this:
    CROE Online

    CROE is not that much different than EURO.
    Seems to me that these two speeches were delivered to rather similarly extremist groups.

    Seems to me that the politician's treatment should be about the same. Shouldn't it?
    Disinformation campaign? The Russian collusion meme pushed by the 'news' media, behaving as a political propaganda organ, hell bent to destroy a legitimately elected president to implement his agenda per the votes of the same electorate. Reference The Big Lie Reference Goebbels

  10. #110
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    Re: Scalise Allegedly Spoke with White Supremacy Group

    Quote Originally Posted by smb View Post
    I disagree with you completely on the motivation. I do not know if Scalise is a racist or not. It is not my motivation nor the motivation of any other liberal I know to prove that. What this is an example of tone deafness. I do not believe most or even a significant number of those in the conservative movement are racists. I do believe that most racist groups identify with the conservative movement. Because many of the racist groups in this country seek or believe they are tied to the conservative movement I think it is incumbent on the conservative movement to much more attune to racism and racist concerns then liberal groups. It is not fair but it is reality. The modern conservative movement has, for reasons unbeknownst to me, adopted an almost systemic policy of deafness to racial issues. It seems that if they walk and talk as if racial issues don't exist they won't exist. That is not reality. What then happens is the conservative movement gets tagged fairly or unfairly with the racist tag. Things like going to a group to be a speaker and not first checking to see if their a racist organization is case and point. I have a problem with Scalise not showing due diligence and being tone deaf to racial politics...not what any of us liberal or conservative need in the leadership of our country.
    I see what you're saying, but I disagree with the approach to ending racism. Pretty much what happens is that liberals tend towards magnifying racial issues, while conservatives tend towards minimizing them. Is our goal to make racial issues a bigger deal or a smaller one?? I think that we can agree that making them a smaller issue is a goal we can get behind. Yes?? But what happens is that non-racial issues get turned into racial issues by liberals far too often. So often that for a lot of this country, they get tuned out. Then, when a real racial issue comes up, it gets filed along with the fabricated issues. We need clear identification of when a real racial issue comes up and that's where liberals are screwing up BIG TIME. Too many are willing to make ANY white on black issue automatically a racial issue, when for the most part they are no different than black on black, white on white or black on white. The gross over-reaction by the left has made this issue almost laughable, since they are willing to claim racism when there is none so often that it's become almost a joke. People who intentionally fabricate racist accusations with nothing to base them on except the fact that it was white on black have clouded this issue so badly that no one in their right mind will get behind the idiocy that so many of these claims are based on. As a result, when a real racial issue comes up and same over-reactionaries start demanding justice (rightfully so), they've lost credibility to the point that they hurt their cause more than help it. Right now, the left in this country is over-reacting so badly to racial issues that people are starting to get fed up with it and ignoring every claim.
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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