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Thread: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by gdgyva View Post
    now it is fairly simple to see that as a % of the population, blacks are arrested (hence commit) more crimes than other races
    I hope you don't think that's an actual logical conclusion. That postulation only works if 100% of people who commit crimes are arrested.

    I think, if you were to disproportionately interrogate one race over all others, that race would always have a higher arrest rate. For example: if you stop and frisk 50% more black people than you do white people, you are probably going to double the rate of drug charges for black people.

    Agreed?
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    I've not really seen enough info on this. I've heard that narrative, but but "threatening" do you mean he was actually threatening them, or just being a dumb kid and pretending he had a real gun and pointing it at people? The latter is something I could see almost any 12-year old doing. It's going to be very hard to convince me that there was a justification to shoot a 12-year old who had a BB gun without proper warning.

    And John Crawford? How was he an idiot? It's an open carry state. Why were the cops even called?
    Cops cant make that discernment from a 911 call. What the cops heard was "There is a man in the park pointing a gun at people. It is probably fake...who knows...but still..." When they arrived on the scene they expected to find a man with a gun. They found a man, reaching under his shirt and pulling out a gun. They realized later it was a kid, not a man, and it was an airsoft gun and not the .45 it was meant to be taken as.

    BTW...the kids grandmother said he bought the gun specifically to intimidate people because he was being bullied at school. His intent was pretty well known. And yes...he was a 12 year old with an adolescent brain. That still = stupid.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    I hope you don't think that's an actual logical conclusion. That postulation only works if 100% of people who commit crimes are arrested.

    I think, if you were to disproportionately interrogate one race over all others, that race would always have a higher arrest rate. For example: if you stop and frisk 50% more black people than you do white people, you are probably going to double the rate of drug charges for black people.

    Agreed?


    look at the damn table

    whites get arrested for domestic abuse, drunk driving, embezzlement, etc

    blacks lead in % for murders, robberies, violent crimes

    Violent crime 391,467 228,782 151,627

    Robbery 78,538 32,945 44,271

    Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter 8,383 3,799 4,379

    these arent stop and frisk statistics

    these are violent crimes.....being committed by black people way more proportionally than whites

    want to try again?
    “Most of the shadows of this life are caused by standing in one's own sunshine.”

    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Fix the problems with the community. If we have problems with law enforcement...we can work on that too. But fix the problems with the community and see if we still have the problems with law enforcement. I'm betting we wont, and if we do, those problems will mirror the problems every other race faces.
    (Snipped quote to save space)

    I agree with that, though I don't think there is a question that we have a problem with law enforcement.

    Regarding the community - I think that's a big key to fixing this country. It's a huge elephant in the room that no one talks about, because if you talk about it one way you're racist, and if you talk about it the other way you're a race baiter. It's a problem that I would leave to sociologists for the most part, because they have the ability to see the bigger picture and the historical knowledge to understand it. However, I think it has to address a few issues:

    1) The continued segregation
    2) Continued racial tensions
    3) Unequal education opportunities
    4) Residual effects of Jim Crow

    It's crazy for me to realize I was born 2 decades after it was illegal for blacks and whites to share a water fountain in my town. And I think it's even crazier to think that just because that generation is aging now, we should have all moved on. Clearly people haven't moved on, and unless we have these types of conversations, racism will have just moved from out in the public to in back rooms, and problems with violence will continue to be blamed on "black thugs" or "corrupt cops".
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    And John Crawford? How was he an idiot? It's an open carry state. Why were the cops even called?
    John Crawford. Police recieved a 911 call about a man in Walmart carrying a gun, ;pointing at people, even women and children, and waving it around. They didnt go to WalMart and find the cute pics of John Crawford we had posted afterward carrying a bb gun in a box...they found a man carrying a weapon, no box in sight. You dont think that is stupid?

    The dialogue was that a white guy can carry a gun and not be harrassed and a black guy is shot. The difference is not in the skin color but in how they are carrying the weapon. If a white guy is carrying the gun, real or not, and pointing it at people in a threatening manner...that is stupid and he will most likely be shot.

    Cops dont see this cute guy holding his mama...
    images (7).jpg
    they see a guy carrying this pointing it at people.images (8).jpg

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    (Snipped quote to save space)

    I agree with that, though I don't think there is a question that we have a problem with law enforcement.

    Regarding the community - I think that's a big key to fixing this country. It's a huge elephant in the room that no one talks about, because if you talk about it one way you're racist, and if you talk about it the other way you're a race baiter. It's a problem that I would leave to sociologists for the most part, because they have the ability to see the bigger picture and the historical knowledge to understand it. However, I think it has to address a few issues:

    1) The continued segregation
    2) Continued racial tensions
    3) Unequal education opportunities
    4) Residual effects of Jim Crow

    It's crazy for me to realize I was born 2 decades after it was illegal for blacks and whites to share a water fountain in my town. And I think it's even crazier to think that just because that generation is aging now, we should have all moved on. Clearly people haven't moved on, and unless we have these types of conversations, racism will have just moved from out in the public to in back rooms, and problems with violence will continue to be blamed on "black thugs" or "corrupt cops".
    We cant move forward, let alone 'move on' if we arent willing to address the problems. If the dialogue consists of "white people bad" then that will be as effective and productive as "black people bad".

    I agree completely there are changes and I completely understand the conflict and struggles most inner city black communities face. I've said that for several years here...there are real problems and they should be addressed.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    We cant move forward, let alone 'move on' if we arent willing to address the problems. If the dialogue consists of "white people bad" then that will be as effective and productive as "black people bad".

    I agree completely there are changes and I completely understand the conflict and struggles most inner city black communities face. I've said that for several years here...there are real problems and they should be addressed.
    The only way to move foward is to address the possibility that racism is an problem that is inherent in the society of the United States.
    "If you can't stand the way this place is, Take yourself to higher places!"
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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Cops dont see this cute guy holding his mama...

    they see a guy carrying this pointing it at people.
    I just don't see the logical step in either case to be shooting the person before they can explain themselves (though I was not aware that Crawford had pointed the toy gun at people).
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    We cant move forward, let alone 'move on' if we arent willing to address the problems. If the dialogue consists of "white people bad" then that will be as effective and productive as "black people bad".

    I agree completely there are changes and I completely understand the conflict and struggles most inner city black communities face. I've said that for several years here...there are real problems and they should be addressed.
    I agree. That's why, even though both sides are being dramatic about it, if this whole thing leads to an honest and open discussion about police profiling and issues within the black community then I'm happy about it.

    Though I have a feeling it will just end with people calling each other names.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    The entire protest is about holding police responsible for their actions...
    Too bad the destruction/theft of property and disturbing the peace overshadowed the reason.

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