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Police: Officer in Missouri shot, Killed man who Pulled Gun..... [W:22]

apdst said:
Oh, now its unintended racism. :lamo
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Well, there has to be " racism " somewhere.

Maybe we're not looking hard enough.
 
Napoleon said:
What you are describing are individual people making poor choices and having to live with the consequences of their actions. That isn't evidence of racism, systematic or otherwise.
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There's a lot of things that go into it, like people not having any other options but to sell drugs because they grew up in a community where their whole families are partaking in this black market
 
Libertie76 said:
There's a lot of things that go into it, like people not having any other options but to sell drugs because they grew up in a community their whole families are partaking in this black market
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People make a conscious decision to engage in that behavior. They always have a choice.
 
paddymcdougall said:
I posted a link earlier in this thread. When you look at police shootings, blacks are disproportionately killed based on their % of population. Yes, more white people are killed - but not when you look at it as as % of their population in the country.
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There are nearly 3x more whites shot by police than blacks. Its damn hard to claim that black folks are being targeted by cops, using those numbers.

Here's another fact that kills your argument: there are as many cops shot in the line of duty as their are black folks shot by cops.
 
Napoleon said:
People make a conscious decision to engage in that behavior. They always have a choice.
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I understand what your saying and I agree people should be held accountable for their actions in terms of breaking the law, however he law itself is unconstitutional in terms of the war on drugs.
 
Fenton said:
Well, there has to be " racism " somewhere.

Maybe we're not looking hard enough.
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The sad part, is that the people that make these arguments aren't the least bit embarrassed to do so.
 
Libertie76 said:
Did I ever say that these policies were intentionally created to target the black community in a negative manner? Please if I did show me my quote
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Yes, you did.
 
apdst said:
The sad part, is that the people that make these arguments aren't the least bit embarrassed to do so.
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The sad part is when people have no real political or economical response and just insult someone instead
 
VanceMack said:
Nothing in my comments to you is defensive, nor is there a reason to BE defensive. Its entirely comical you interpreted the conversation I was in as defensive. Like I said...speaks VOLUMES of you.
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I see that you did not address my accusation of your gross lack of understanding of race and racism. Once you properly do that, we can talk.

Grant said:
What can you add to this understanding?
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Great question! But would you listen to it if I obliged? Do you have evidence that you have listened to uncomfortable talks about race and racism?
 
Libertie76 said:
I understand what your saying and I agree people should be held accountable for their actions in terms of breaking the law, however he law itself is unconstitutional in terms of the war on drugs.
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Thats good. The constitutionality of the "war on drugs" is a separate issue.
 
Libertie76 said:
Did you show me the quote?
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You blame racist policies. Racism is a conscious and deliberate act. If a policy is racist, then it is intended to target a racial group.
 
apdst said:
There are nearly 3x more whites shot by police than blacks. Its damn hard to claim that black folks are being targeted by cops, using those numbers.

Here's another fact that kills your argument: there are as many cops shot in the line of duty as their are black folks shot by cops.
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Talk show host: Police kill more whites than blacks | PunditFact

However, even the incomplete figures gathered by the government tell us that Medved could be partially correct and still ignore a huge piece of the picture. Yes, more whites than blacks die as a result of an encounter with police, but whites also represent a much bigger chunk of the total population.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention keeps data on fatal injuries from 1999 to 2011 and one category is homicides by legal intervention. The term "legal intervention" covers any situation when a person dies at the hands of anyone authorized to use deadly force in the line of duty.

Over the span of more than a decade, 2,151 whites died by being shot by police compared to 1,130 blacks. In that respect, Medved is correct.

However, Brian Forst, a professor in the Department of Justice, Law and Criminology at American University, said this difference is predictable.

"More whites are killed by the police than blacks primarily because whites outnumber blacks in the general population by more than five to one," Forst said. The country is about 63 percent white and 12 percent black.
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(bolding mine)

FYI, police officers are not at the top of dangerous occupations.
 
Libertie76 said:
The sad part is when people have no real political or economical response and just insult someone instead
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Even worse, is when folks conjur up Imagined insults.
 
apdst said:
You blame racist policies. Racism is a conscious and deliberate act. If a policy is racist, then it is intended to target a racial group.
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Wow your reaching for the sky to try and attempt to discredit me, however yes being a racist is a conscious thought process, however having policies unintentionally creating systematic racism is a result if a failed policy. Please quote me saying it was intended to hold the black community down
 
Napoleon said:
Thats good. The constitutionality of the "war on drugs" is a separate issue.
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Well it is until you realize how it's a non legal fake policy that is contributing to the inner cities dependence on black market sales spiking crime rates and spiking a lesser drive for educational advancement. The war on drugs is a necessity that needs to be talked about when discussing systematic racism
 
apdst said:
Even worse, is when folks conjur up Imagined insults.
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"The sad part, is that the people that make these arguments aren't the least bit embarrassed to do so."
who are u referring to in this statement
 
Phys251 said:
I see that you did not address my accusation of your gross lack of understanding of race and racism. Once you properly do that, we can talk.



Great question! But would you listen to it if I obliged? Do you have evidence that you have listened to uncomfortable talks about race and racism?
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You mistake me for someone that gives a **** about your opinion or anything you have to say. Reread your intro to this conversation and start over. Or don't. I literally could not care less if you paid me to.
 
Libertie76 said:
Well it is until you realize how it's a non legal fake policy that is contributing to the inner cities dependence on black market sales spiking crime rates and spiking a lesser drive for educational advancement. The war on drugs is a necessity that needs to be talked about when discussing systematic racism
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If people choose to purchase, sell, or consume illegal substances those are individual choices. If people choose not pursue education those are individual choices. Neither of those things constitute systematic racism which you allege exists. How are you reaching the conclusion that the consequences of a person's decision to make bad choices in life are racist?
 
Napoleon said:
If people choose to purchase, sell, or consume illegal substances those are individual choices. If people choose not pursue education those are individual choices. Neither of those things constitute systematic racism which you allege exists. How are you reaching the conclusion that the consequences of a person's decision to make bad choices in life are racist?
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The higher effect of war on drugs have destroyed the inner cities in the United States causing less opportunity for economic and educational growth. The individual basis I agree, however as a societal problem it's the failure of the policy that has destroyed these communities. The failure of the policy is a growth of systematic racism because statistically blacks and Hispanics live in these areas and are effected by it worse. Causing the system to demographically tend to restrict the actual advancement of a majority of minorities.

This is how it's systematic racism because then blacks or Hispanics feel like they are being held down by unfair balances in the entire community of the Americans. This promotes ideas of racial differences and a pseudo blind eye of criminal and civil justice systems not representing their portion of the community. These social problems are a direct cause of failed policy, and systematically it has created racial oppression because people being born and raised in these communities might not have the knowledge or resources to be able to advance economically and educationally. Why? Because the system has failed them.

If your parents are making you steal to support their drug habit or if you sell drugs to support your family at a young age your chance of growing out of it is horrendous . Not to mention most drug offenses are felonies so were talking convicted felon finding a higher paying job?

It's not always black and white, and trust me I blame The media for glorifying drug sells and gang members just as much as I blame the policy. There is a lot of effects the system has created to make it harder for blacks on average to succeed in his country. I say the best we can do is get rid of the policies that have to these negative effects
 
apdst said:
Nothing about that supports your argument.
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I had two things in that post -

1) that blacks are killed by cops at a rate disproportionate to their population - article proved that

2) that police work is not the most dangerous occupation. I figured everyone knew that, but feel free to google it
 
Libertie76 said:
The higher effect of war on drugs have destroyed the inner cities in the United States causing less opportunity for economic and educational growth. The individual basis I agree, however as a societal problem it's the failure of the policy that has destroyed these communities. The failure of the policy is a growth of systematic racism because statistically blacks and Hispanics live in these areas and are effected by it worse. Causing the system to demographically tend to restrict the actual advancement of a majority of minorities.

This is how it's systematic racism because then blacks or Hispanics feel like they are being held down by unfair balances in the entire community of the Americans. This promotes ideas of racial differences and a pseudo blind eye of criminal and civil justice systems not representing their portion of the community. These social problems are a direct cause of failed policy, and systematically it has created racial oppression because people being born and raised in these communities might not have the knowledge or resources to be able to advance economically and educationally. Why? Because the system has failed them.

If your parents are making you steal to support their drug habit or if you sell drugs to support your family at a young age your chance of growing out of it is horrendous . Not to mention most drug offenses are felonies so were talking convicted felon finding a higher paying job?

It's not always black and white, and trust me I blame The media for glorifying drug sells and gang members just as much as I blame the policy. There is a lot of effects the system has created to make it harder for blacks on average to succeed in his country. I say the best we can do is get rid of the policies that have to these negative effects
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We arrive at the heart of the argument at last. The counter argument is very simple and you should spend some time contemplating it. People don't get to claim that racist machinations are denying them equal opportunity just because they've squandered it. Equal opportunity means that a person can reasonably expect the same or similar rewards for making wise choices but it also means that you have to take your lumps like everyone else when you make bad ones.
 
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paddymcdougall said:
I had two things in that post -

1) that blacks are killed by cops at a rate disproportionate to their population - article proved that

2) that police work is not the most dangerous occupation. I figured everyone knew that, but feel free to google it
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Blacls are murdered by other blacks wasaay more disproportionately than that. Where's the outrage?
 
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