Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 62

Thread: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

  1. #11
    Sage
    Anthony60's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northern New Jersey
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,566

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother AJ View Post
    A human infant actually.
    A human infant is going to appeal the case? What about cartoon characters? Can they get in on this too? Can Speed Racer sue for a real driver's license?
    "We have met the enemy and they are ours..." -- Oliver Hazard Perry
    "I don't want a piece of you... I want the whole thing!" -- Bob Barker

  2. #12
    Advisor Brother AJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Last Seen
    10-28-17 @ 11:09 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    560
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    Note that it's only a fallacy if one is making an argument based on it. I was merely lamenting, although a bit hyperbolically.

    But I can make a valid ad absurdum argument. Why should we grant monkeys human rights, but not, say, flies?
    1. They're apes not monkeys.

    2. They would be orangutan rights not "human rights" because an orangutan isn't a human obviously. The case didn't argue that she was a human, but a person.

    3. Because apes are obviously drastically different from flies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    When it happens in a country that matters I'll pay attention. I say that as a supporter of cetacean and primate rights.
    WTF?! It all matters. It matters to that orangutan. You sound rather elitist if you ask me.

  3. #13
    Advisor Brother AJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Last Seen
    10-28-17 @ 11:09 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    560
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    A human infant is going to appeal the case? What about cartoon characters? Can they get in on this too? Can Speed Racer sue for a real driver's license?
    You ask a ridiculous question, and you'll get a ridiculous answer. I'd love to hear your potentially rational thoughts on why this ruling is so absurd you.

  4. #14
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Last Seen
    06-30-16 @ 07:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,309
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother AJ View Post
    1. They're apes not monkeys.

    2. They would be orangutan rights not "human rights" because an orangutan isn't a human obviously. The case didn't argue that she was a human, but a person.

    3. Because apes are obviously drastically different from flies.


    WTF?! It all matters. It matters to that orangutan. You sound rather elitist if you ask me.
    1. Ok

    2. Semantics

    3. Such as?

  5. #15
    Sage
    Sherman123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Northeast US
    Last Seen
    11-23-17 @ 11:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,774

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother AJ View Post
    1. They're apes not monkeys.

    2. They would be orangutan rights not "human rights" because an orangutan isn't a human obviously. The case didn't argue that she was a human, but a person.

    3. Because apes are obviously drastically different from flies.


    WTF?! It all matters. It matters to that orangutan. You sound rather elitist if you ask me.
    The orangutan should be treated humanely as befitting an intelligent creature. However it doesn't 'care' about the proceedings because it isn't even aware of them or what they mean. I'm not going to pay close attention to any legal ruling coming out of Argentina of all places.

  6. #16
    Uncanny
    Paschendale's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    New York City
    Last Seen
    03-31-16 @ 04:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    12,510

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    This is hardly unprecedented. Animal cruelty is a crime in many countries, including the United States. We afford many animals a right against violence and neglect.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

  7. #17
    Advisor Brother AJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Last Seen
    10-28-17 @ 11:09 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    560
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    The orangutan should be treated humanely as befitting an intelligent creature.
    Hm. And should unintelligent humans and other animals be treated inhumanely?

    However it doesn't 'care' about the proceedings because it isn't even aware of them or what they mean.
    She's a she actually. It will matter to her because her quality of life could be drastically improved if the ruling isn't appealed.

    I'm not going to pay close attention to any legal ruling coming out of Argentina of all places.
    Why?

  8. #18
    Sage
    Hatuey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    42,053

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    It's all fun and games until someone's face gets bitten off.
    ... Are companies taking bath salts now?

    (Figure out the joke, it's complex, but it's there).
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  9. #19
    Dungeon Master
    anti socialist

    X Factor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Texas Proud
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:48 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    44,727

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    Good. Animals should have some basic legal protections.

  10. #20
    Educator GreatNews2night's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Last Seen
    04-07-17 @ 01:26 AM
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    699

    Re: Court in Argentina grants basic rights to orangutan

    This is not a first. A court in a semi-autonomous island that is part of Spain has ruled similarly in the past. I don't remember which island; maybe Minorca. I don't have a link; I read this news a while ago. Basically they recognized primates as persons, granted them a number of personhood rights, and made killing a primate a felony similar to killing a human (but punished with smaller sentences).

    I believe it is a scientific fact (as confirmed by a panel of scientists from Oxford University) that many animal species are sentient. The Oxford panel included many species; I'd probably be a little more restrictive and consider as such only the highly intelligent ones like the great apes, the dolphins, and let's not forget the pigs (it is a poorly known fact that pigs are highly intelligent, much more than dogs and cats). Those species whose individuals have a sense of self, understand their destiny, anticipate their demise with anguish, have a concept of families and loved ones, have some sort of rudimentary language or the ability to learn one, etc., as it's been proven about a few animal species, should enjoy some protections under the law. It would be the humane thing to do.

    Animal cruelty of any kind is despicable, however I don't think that considering very unsophisticated animals such as fish and chicken as livestock, harvested or raised for human consumption, is particularly wrong; hopefully more humane methods for raising and killing them should be employed; this said, I'll gladly eat them. I'm no vegetarian, much less vegan. I love meat. I think cows are also not very intelligent (while Oxford University considered all large mammals as sentient).

    The highly intelligent species, though, I'd be a lot more sympathetic towards them. Great Apes and dolphins are clearly capable of human-like thinking and should enjoy several rights, I think.
    Last edited by GreatNews2night; 12-22-14 at 01:13 AM.

Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •