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Thread: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recession

  1. #491
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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    I am glad you are doing so well. That is good to hear.

    But even in good positions in companies most employees will usually not do the math. But it works its way through the system anyway, by reducing the P/L of the supervisor or branch manager or managing director.

    This does not mean that every minimum wage will cause visible reductions of jobs. There have been a good number of studies with opposite findings. What you will always find, though, is that the impact is due to a number of contributing and limiting factors that reshuffle the costs, so that the effect is become invisible, but are felt elsewhere. Cost increases affect general competitiveness negatively, when the cost of a product is increased without increasing its qualities.
    The larger the business, the more areas there are to absorb the cost in an increase. This is where I say that the achilles heel of minimum wage is that it can be very harmful to small businesses, but then, most small businesses pay above minimum wage anyway...exactly for that reason.

    BJ's, the company I work for, already has a contingency plan in place for WHEN the minimum wage goes up. For starters, the lowest paid position, bakery clerks and deli clerks, start out .70 cents above minimum wage. This is to help absorb it when it does happen. There is policy in place to prevent employees from asking for a raise the moment it happens, as well. I mean, they can ask...but it's against company policy to give more than one raise per year. From there, the rest of the costs are going to be passed on to consumers, in the form of slightly increased membership costs, (5 dollars more per year) and an up tick on markup of some groups of items, already selected, by about 6%. In other words, it'll increase certain items by pennies on the dollar, such that out members won't notice. Since we don't pay minimum wage at any of our locations, these measures are predicted to easily absorb any costs associated with an increase to minimum wage.

    Honestly, I've seen the minimum wage go up several times in my life. It used to be 5.15, when I first started working. Since I've been in management, across various fields, in several businesses, I have weathered two increases. And saw little to no change...in anything.

    The ONLY thing that has had such an affect as you guys are describing in my lifetime was when they passed AHCA.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

  2. #492
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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    Got me fooled.

    Maybe you fool easily.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

  3. #493
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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    ...Cost increases affect general competitiveness negatively...
    Not when all competitors have the same cost increases. Relative to each other, their competiveness exactly the same.

    The only way that we would lose competitiveness is against foreign labor, but that foreign labor doesn't compete for min wage jobs in the US. Someone in China can't flip burgers in the US.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    Yes. Do you?
    I said explain. Then I'll tell you if I have the same as you.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    Not when all competitors have the same cost increases. Relative to each other, their competiveness exactly the same.

    The only way that we would lose competitiveness is against foreign labor, but that foreign labor doesn't compete for min wage jobs in the US. Someone in China can't flip burgers in the US.
    True. Only the floor cleaners at the t-shirt factory, unless one hamburger flipper is fired, while the other employer has a heart.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    Maybe you fool easily.
    I'll let my results speak for themselves.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I said explain. Then I'll tell you if I have the same as you.
    You first. I've danced to this tune before.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    Not really. Studies on previous increases in minimum wage pretty much 100% concluded that increasing min wage did not cause unemployment, mostly because there was no uptick in the unemployment rate during those time periods. So someone decides to "prove" that increases in min wage cause unemployment, and they then only study the one increase in minimum wage that happened to be the same year that the Great Recession starts.

    You don't think that may show intellectual dishonesty? There is absolutely no way to conclude that X jobs were lost due to the increase in minimum wage, when we were losing jobs like crazy due to a deep recession. If they wanted to be honest about it, they would have studied the entire history of minimum wage increases instead of looking at the single outlier.
    Sorrily my longish response has disappeared and is therefore lost to posterity and the living. But I would like to include a meta study that seemed to shine some light on the reasons for the variance between the results from the many studies we find in the literature. I found it good at showing some methods also: http://ftp.iza.org/dp4983.pdf

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    You first. I've danced to this tune before.
    I asked first. And if you've danced, you know an honest answer is the quickest way to do this.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Study: The 2007 minimum wage hike cost more than 1 million jobs during the recess

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I asked first. And if you've danced, you know an honest answer is the quickest way to do this.
    LOL. As usual, a radical lib who demands things from others they won't do for themselves. You asked a question about experience in a national economy. What lame and loaded question. Something a child might ask.

    I've managed to start a company that ended up doing billions in sales over 25 years, and had manufacturing facilities in multiple states. I sold my final interest a few years back, and now I own a company that manufactures products sold in every state, and in other parts of the world. My experience is not only national, but global.

    What is your experience?

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