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Thread: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Charles P Pierce has a few words to say to the defenders of torture

    All The Right People: The Contagious Exercise Of State Violence - Esquire

    Somewhere in itself, and not very far from the surface, either, this country has gone mad with fear and rage. As a result, it is finding sustenance in the acts of official violence, and doing so in more different ways than the republic has seen since we had lynching, union busting, and Red Scares at the same time, back when the 19th century was turning into the 20th. Anyone who can't see the political and sociological tissue connecting the deaths of Michael Brown and Eric Garner, and the revelations of a decade's worth of CIA brutality, and the execution of Robert Holsey isn't looking hard enough. In the country's untrammeled fear and rage, it is exercising the only function of self-government it can recall as its mad brain turns to red fire -- to encourage the exercise of the state's power to wound and kill all the right people. In this madness, race and class are mere diagnostic categories. In this madness, the politics of right and left, of Republicans and Democrats, of conservatives and liberals, of red and blue, are pathetically inadequate to assess the situation. In this madness, the choices are not made within the easy and obvious contexts. This is a choice between barbarism and not, between savagery and not. This is a choice between the national soul and the national Id. This is a choice of whether to take inchoate and weaponized vengeance against the living representations of the monsters in our paranoid dreams. That's the last vestige of self-government that we have allowed ourselves. The right to demand that the institutions of government kill what we fear. By any means necessary, as someone once said.
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    I do wonder if some folks aren't at least starting to fear the consequences of what they did. Although I'm not sure the "He did it first" excuse works any better in the International Criminal Court than it did in kindergarten

    Cheney Throws Bush Under The Bus On Torture Program

    Dick Cheney discussed the newly released Senate torture report Wednesday on Fox News, and in particular challenged a finding that former President George W. Bush hadn't been briefed on the CIA's harsh interrogation methods until years after they'd already been in use.

    Fox News anchor Bret Baier asked the former vice president whether the agency deliberately kept Bush in the dark about its so-called enhanced interrogation techniques.

    "Not true. Didn't happen," Cheney responded. "Read his book, he talks about it extensively in his memoirs. He was in fact an integral part of the program, he had to approve it before we went forward with it."
    Then we get a typical non-answer answer to the question posed

    Asked if there was ever a point where he knew more about the CIA's activity than the President, Cheney said "I think he knew everything he needed to know and wanted to know about the program."
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    Charles P Pierce has a few words to say to the defenders of torture
    Ah yes, All things that the US is, or does is evil, and only collectivism can save us.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Ah yes, All things that the US is, or does is evil, and only collectivism can save us.
    Succinctly stated - THE problem we face in America today - "You're with us or you're against us" with zero acknowledgement of complexity

    Some people see only the negative in their opponents' speech, some people seem to only be able to accept the "all or nothing" premise in politics. They see criticism of one favoured action as being criticism of everything.

    " In this madness, the choices are not made within the easy and obvious contexts. This is a choice between barbarism and not, between savagery and not. "
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    Succinctly stated - THE problem we face in America today - "You're with us or you're against us" with zero acknowledgement of complexity
    Complexity as you state it here is only a means to stalemate...I assure you our enemies don't share your view of fighting for a draw.

    Some people see only the negative in their opponents' speech, some people seem to only be able to accept the "all or nothing" premise in politics. They see criticism of one favoured action as being criticism of everything.
    Socialism is not the "favored action" in America, and never will be...That is only your own pipe dream.

    " In this madness, the choices are not made within the easy and obvious contexts. This is a choice between barbarism and not, between savagery and not. "
    So why should Charles P Peirce, a frequent guest on the far left Stephanie Miller show, speak to me? I understand you think he is spot on because he and you are like minded socialists...Doesn't change the fact that America is not now, nor will it become a communist country.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I don't support other countries charging our CIA staff for anything, sorry.

    Will it be a good thing when they charge Barack Obama for his drone attacks that are killing children, too?
    I'm sure such a report will come forward in time. History will tell how deadly and perhaps non-surgical U.S. drone strikes were. In the mean time, let's not try to deflect.
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So, why did you try to trot out a dishonest CNN article like you did? And if you are lapping up that report from Feinsten's aids, then you should be smart enough to know that Feinstein was briefed many times while it was ongoing and said or did NOTHING to stop it...In fact reports were that she egged it on, just like Pelosi, and Rockefeller....So...What do you call that? I call it highly dishonest.

    The CNN article was not dishonest, nor was the report on torture. If you want to cast blame on the Democrats, go ahead. I won't argue with you there.

    The main thing is to acknowledge what really happened so that history won't repeat itself.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh, so you believe it is ongoing today?
    I don't know. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that it is.

    Of course, Obama said that it ended, but then, Bush said that the US doesn't torture. Do you believe either one of them?
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    The CNN article was not dishonest, nor was the report on torture. If you want to cast blame on the Democrats, go ahead. I won't argue with you there.

    The main thing is to acknowledge what really happened so that history won't repeat itself.

    The "183 times" quote was but one inaccuracy...The entire op-ed attempt at journalism is just proof that we don't have an objective press, and people like you buy into the propaganda.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Senate panel releases scathing report on CIA interrogation...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    I don't know. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that it is.

    Of course, Obama said that it ended, but then, Bush said that the US doesn't torture. Do you believe either one of them?
    Yeah, yeah....Sure...:
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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