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Thread: No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by avery45 View Post
    I tend to lean conservative/republican and this one has me. Not sure why he isn't, at least going, to trial.
    His neighbors, the Grand Jury reviewed the evidence the prosecutor had and determined there was insufficient evidence to declare a crime occurred. If no crime occurred why would anyone go to trial?

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Those with tyrannical hearts always speak this way.

    Civilians, members of the community, saw the evidence the prosecutor had and determined there was insufficient evidence to prove a crime had occurred. I trust non-governmental civilians. They get it right most of the time.

    It is time for the police to arm up and this time shoot the arsonists.
    Your response, and the response you're responding to, represent the two extremes, neither of which know all of the evidence.

    I do find this no-indictment surprising. Something doesn't seem right. This is a guy selling ciggies w/o tax. Seems to me any policeman would not want to turn a minor infraction into a death-causing incident, esp. using a disallowed choke hold (disallowed because it kills people). I think I can guess why he felt he had to use it. But then again, we're talking about a guy selling ciggies w/o tax. Not a serious crime like running a red light.

    But I'm not familiar with all the evidence. I'd like to know more.
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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by rcart76 View Post
    I just saw this part.

    Can anyone please explain to me how the GJ came to their conclusion after two examiners agreed that this was a homicide?

    Keep in mind that this is to get it to go to a trial.
    Homicide is the act of a human killing another human.
    I think we can all agree that the acts of one human contributed to the death of another human. The phrase you are grasping for is criminal homicide. Apparently, the Grand Jury determined that no criminal act could be proved.

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by rcart76 View Post
    This shouldn't have to be a conservative vs democrat thing. This is a civil rights thing. If police can't get indicted on this, then the Grand Jury proceedings is just a gimmick.

    What is the point of doing it if it involves cops?
    You really do not like justice do you?

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    The good news is that, according to CNN, exactly nothing else bad is happening anywhere else in the world and the only newsworthy event of any kind today was the grand jury's decision on this matter. Otherwise, today was, in CNN's view, utopian. Nothing else happened today of any significance whatsoever.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Personally, I'm troubled by this one far more so than the Ferguson decision. In the Ferguson incident, Michael Brown absolutely contributed to and caused his own demise. In this case, in NYC, we're talking about what is virtually a by-law infraction - selling cigarettes loosely, without tax, and local variety stores and businesses pressure police to stop it. But nobody, in my view, should die because they broke a by-law. Now, this man clearly was resisting arrest - he was surrounded by police and he kept pulling his hands back when the police tried to handcuff him. As with Michael Brown, this man is another "gentle giant". What is it about big black men that they resist arrest to the death?

    This is a case, I believe, that should have gone to trial so that the entire NYC community could see and review the evidence and a jury could pass judgement on whether or not manslaughter was an appropriate charge. The community, in this case, should determine whether or not a banned choke hold being used in order to secure an arrest is reasonable force. For me, I don't see why the police didn't simply issue the man a summons to appear in court on the by-law charge.

    This one bothers me a lot.

    Edit: It seems that the man in this case had 31 prior arrests for similar minor offenses and apparently "knew the drill" - what possessed him to resist this one to the death is puzzling.
    Ditto. This incident is different from the Brown incident. 31 prior arrests for similar offenses? I guess that's why they were arresting him instead of ticketing him. He may have not paid for all those prior tickets.
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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by Carleen View Post
    Wow, pure hatred.
    It did not seem pure. Impure hate. Absolutely. I am somewhat surprised at the number of people on this board who abhor the concept of justice. A grand Jury, citizens called from the community, reviewed the prosecutor's evidence and determined that there was insufficient evidence to charge anyone with a crime.

    If riots occur they must be put down with force. Anyone attempting to set fire to a building should be shot by sniper fire. No fires. Protest actual justice all you want.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by JumpinJack View Post
    Did you see the comment by TheDemSocialist that the choke hold was prohibited and against protocol? That means he was not "doing his job." This incident is totally different from the Brown incident.

    But reasonable people want to know all of the evidence before reaching a conclusion. What I read says that Garner told them he couldn't breathe. If that's true, I am flabbergasted they didn't let up on the disallowed choke hold. IF they didn't let up on it.

    But in all things, policeman have to weigh actions with consequences with possibles crimes, it seems to me. Selling ciggies with no tax is just not a big deal. Something you'd give a ticket for. Not arrest for. It's not serious like, say, running a red light. You don't want to turn a minor offense into, say, the death of someone. Especially using a choke hold that is against protocol.

    I am surprised by the no indictment. But then I haven't seen all the evidence.
    Well here's the full video


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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    It stinks.... my gut just says this is wrong.
    Was your gut on the grand jury?

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    I didn't see resisting. I did hear him say at least 5 times saying he can't breathe.
    I saw him resisting. I am surprised you didn't see it. It was before the first police officer grabbed him.

    The grand jury says no crime.

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