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Thread: No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    If justice is killing an unarmed man for suspicion of selling loose cigarettes - God help us all.
    Justice is having your neighbors evaluate the evidence and decide if there is enough evidence to charge someone with a crime. You can choose to make it about whatever else you want but in the end it comes down to whether or not there is enough evidence to convince your neighbors that a crime occurred and there is enough evidence to charge someone.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Apparently the coroner ruled it as a homicide.
    Apparently, what that means, for people who support the police's action is that he died of natural causes. Seriously.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Why aren't you attacking the liberal establishment that has added taxes upon taxes upon taxes and constrained and restricted people from starting businesses? This case cries out for an anti-tax rebellion. Ultimately it is liberalism that is at the root of this man's death.
    No, that is a complaint, but ultimately is a chock hold, his head being pressed into concrete, an adult's weight on his back and 3 officers slamming him down on concrete - plus due to those officers no citizen could attempt CPS either.

    The violence was singularly initiated by the police. After he was unconscious, it then was the police who assured he then had to die as no one could come to his aid.

    The cigarette tax to make cigarettes a luxury only for the rich didn't kill him. That is what put him standing there. It was his being violently assaulted by numerous police that killed him.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    And hope the courts see things you way. You're not really doing much to counter my points.
    That is the price you pay for being civilised society. It seems you prefer avoiding subtlety and want to be hostile towards law enforcement. That is counter intuitive.

    I don't have a narrative towards this at all. I explained what your response meant. It meant that you believe people should allow themselves to be harassed and then, hopefully, peut-Ítre, one day, maybe, quizas, quizas quizas, they'll get justice.
    No. It means that people should comply with reasonable orders given by law enforcement to have the situation resolved with the least amount of violence possible.

    Even if you aren't a fan of police, saying 'leave me alone' was probably not the best way to handle it.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    It's also too bad the DA decided a grand jury was appropriate. This was a wrongful (albeit accidental) death. "I can't breath - I can't breath - I can't breath" means the guy was subdued. His lying on his stomach with weight on his back from the grappling officers? The consequence of that (his death) can be easily predicted. The officers should have been charged. No grand jury required.
    Cool. So in New York City a grand jury is optional? The government can charge anyone they want for whatever they want without independent citizen involvement? If that is the case then why ever convene a grand jury? Why not just give the prosecutor an enemies list and let him go at it?

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    Then file charges for police harassment. Maybe things would be different today. Even if you have the narrative that police are just hostile towards black men, whate do you think acting hostile in response is going to accomplish?
    The color of his skin is beside the point, though much will be made of it. What they did was just wrong, Black or White, man or woman.

    How is Eric Garner going to file for police harassment?

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Justice is having your neighbors evaluate the evidence and decide if there is enough evidence to charge someone with a crime. You can choose to make it about whatever else you want but in the end it comes down to whether or not there is enough evidence to convince your neighbors that a crime occurred and there is enough evidence to charge someone.
    GJ jurors don't have to be his neighbors. In NY, they don't even need to live in the same city. So the neighbors thing is a bit of a stretch in a city of 10 million. Quit using it.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Eric Garner did not apply a choke-hold on anyone so Newton's third law doesn't apply here.
    It appears he didn't comply with any orders given by police, either. All I know is that police tend to get pretty rough after that starts...

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Apparently, what that means, for people who support the police's action is that he died of natural causes. Seriously.
    There is no factual question over whether it was a homicide nor whether the police assaulted him. Those are just truisms.

    However, the legal question is what it "justifiable homicide," were the assaults illegal, was it "reckless endangerment" or "official oppression?" The prosecutor's office said no, no, no and no - so that's that.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Cool. So in New York City a grand jury is optional? The government can charge anyone they want for whatever they want without independent citizen involvement? If that is the case then why ever convene a grand jury? Why not just give the prosecutor an enemies list and let him go at it?
    The reason for the GJ is because it is required, so a pointless technicality. In fact, there is no purpose to it in application.

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