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Thread: No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    There is no cross examintion during a grand jury since defense council (and normally the accused) are not present. All evidence and witness statements are provided by the prosecutor and are examined (not cross examined) by the jurors.

    cross-examination - definition of cross-examination by The Free Dictionary
    You are correct. That was my attempt at using language he understood.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    There is so much more to know though. I accept he died of a cardiac arrest. I read that he had an enlarged heart and organs and there was significant fat buildups though the aorta was intact and normal. There are a lot of contributing factors. Sure...officers attempting to arrest you after you resisted attempts to detain can certainly cause problems. So could bending over and tying ones own shoes for someone that size. Or eating that last taco. Or trying to have sex. Or taking a dump.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Stop talking. Cigs are taxed. If you buy them from Canada which is highly unlikely since you are paying the same amount. Those cigs are coming from Virginia, PA, Maryland or anyone on the I-95 corridor. Can't stop that, can't prevent it and NYC and NY itself is punishing people doing nothing illegal in the sense they paid taxes on those cigs in those states they bought them at. What NY and NYC did is make it illegal to give or sell cigs between consumers (loosies) as they seem them as contraband.

    This is about NY and NYC wanted more and more money and because they ****ed up and priced themselves out of a market and NYC sits on the boarder of a few states who have cheaper cigs, they had to take it out on someone.. and this someone is people who did nothing illegal just a few years ago.
    I Love 'Loosies': In Defense of Black Market Cigarettes*|*Christopher Mathias

    Canada's boom in smuggled cigarettes | Center for Public Integrity

    Also it is far easier to order untaxed American cigs online from Canada, and very easy to smuggle them into NYC. This has gone on for decades.

    Now I'll stop talking, YOU, start reading.

    Btw, your presumption that buying cigs legally in one state and then transporting them to another and reselling them for what you paid for them is legal, is incorrect. It is very much illegal and the feds will be all over your ass for doing so. Guess what the T in ATF stands for.
    Last edited by clownboy; 12-04-14 at 07:14 PM.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    I think he had a heart attack. Often, one of the tell-tale signs of a heart attack is shortness of breath.

    I read up on this case a little bit more, and confirmed it. He died of coronary problems, not suffocation.
    I heard on a news report that he died of compression to the neck area and I think his back, as it compressed his chest area. Cause of death. The report didn't say heart attack caused his death. But maybe the coroner found that it was the compression that caused the heart attack and so was the cause of death. Not sure. The coroner's report is probably on the internet somewhere.

    Compression may not be the same thing as "suffocation," which is the word you use. I didn't hear "suffocation" being used by the coroner. But maybe it's just semantics.
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Good for him, still doesn't change what I said. NYC and NY priced themselves out of the market.

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Canada's boom in smuggled cigarettes | Center for Public Integrity

    Also it is far easier to order untaxed American cigs online from Canada, and very easy to smuggle them into NYC. This has gone on for decades.
    Again, this isn't illegal. If you notice in your article the biggest sellers are Native Americans who get benefits for being of tribe status. This isn't new and it's rich Canada and US are bitching because they can't revoke status any time they want.. So try again.

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Btw, your presumption that buying cigs legally in one state and then transporting them to another and reselling them for what you paid for them is legal, is incorrect. It is very much illegal and the feds will be all over your ass for doing so. Guess what the T in ATF stands for.
    ATF doesn't do Tobacco anymore, it's actually changed when Homeland Security bill was passed which took and created Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau and left "ATF" with firearms and explosives. ATTTB only cares when the cigs are imported (or giving out licenses) into the US as they are a federal agency. They don't give a flying **** about someone driving down to Virginia to bring cigs up to NY and selling them. What you fail to grasp is they are taxed at some point along the line. The farmer has to pay the government for the crop and no tribe in Canada is growing tobacco, or even New York. So right off the bat, that Tobacco is taxed.

    Problem comes from States who have budget issues and the first thing the hike taxes on are "sin" items as it's less voters you piss off but since States tax differently and some States have to act tough and be police state over the matter.. which NY and NYC are. There in lies the problem. To collect the tax, it requires more man hours, time of court and such then actually collected. Which is why it's asinine.

    They are literally have cops patrol for a "loose". Did all else crime stop?

    But as the poem goes..

    Tax his land, tax his wage,
    Tax his bed in which he lays.
    Tax his tractor, tax his mule,
    Teach him taxes is the rule.

    Tax his cow, tax his goat,
    Tax his pants, tax his coat.
    Tax his ties, tax his shirts,
    Tax his work, tax his dirt.

    Tax his chew, tax his smoke,
    Teach him taxes are no joke.
    Tax his car, tax his grass,
    Tax the roads he must pass.

    Tax his food, tax his drink,
    Tax him if he tries to think.
    Tax his sodas, tax his beers,
    If he cries, tax his tears.

    Tax his bills, tax his gas,
    Tax his notes, tax his cash.
    Tax him good and let him know
    That after taxes, he has no dough.

    If he hollers, tax him more,
    Tax him until he's good and sore.
    Tax his coffin, tax his grave,
    Tax the sod in which he lays.

    Put these words upon his tomb,
    "Taxes drove me to my doom!"
    And when he's gone, we won't relax,
    We'll still be after the inheritance tax.
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Carleen View Post
    Did you watch the video? You call that resisting arrest?
    I watched the video. It took four or five cops to restrain him long enough for one to cuff him. Yes it looked like he resisted arrest.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    If the autopsy showed the choke hold interrupted blood flow (for even 8 seconds) then I suspect that would have been the lead statement. What is most telling is that they havent provided the autopsy report. Considering the video and the size of the individuals, I truly doubt a carotid choke hold was cinched in. But...I have reserved anything definitive because we dont know.

    Why? In a grand jury the prosecuter who is an extension of the local government and law enforcment is the one presenting the case against the cop who is on the same team.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    It contributed to his death - unless you're claiming he would have had a coronary and dropped dead right there if the police didn't drag him to the ground and choke him.
    Sure it contributed...however he resisted arrest. It would not be practical to give all suspects a health checkup before placing them under arrest.

    And that's
    what I'm missing in this case.... I want to see a jury look at that evidence and make a ruling. In this particular case, it warranted a jury reviewing what the police did and how they did it.
    Not according to the grand jury. I am betting they have a lot more information available to them then we do. I would be interested in reading their report if it's released before jumping to any conclusions of guilt. One of the reasons we have grand juries is to avoid suspects being financially ruined unnecessarily...if there is nothing legally to indict him on.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Carleen View Post
    So he deserved to be choked to death? Which chokehold is against the law in NY?
    According to the coroner's report, he was not choked to death.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    I'd also like to restate and clarify.


    This isn't a race issue, this isn't a police on black issue. The number one killer of black men age 15-35 is other black men, not disease, not accidents, etc. it's other black men. While holder and obama are running thier mouths. WHEN have they EVER adressed the most dangerous thing facing black men?

    It's a national tragedy here.


    Police over enforment affects us all. but injeting race into it, isn't right here.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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