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Thread: No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    We have access to everything the DA did not present to the grand jury. Grand juries in NY do what the DA tells them. You message is naļve at best.
    And this further highlights you do not know and/or understand how the process works. Do you know why not all cases are brought before a grand jury but instead go directly to trial? NY prosecutors only invoke the GJ option when they are sure they have a case for charges, when they wish to compel a deal or when the public and/or politicians might balk at their decision not to bring charges for lack of evidence of a crime. They are very much concerned with their conviction percentage and perception politics on the ground.

    Further, the department isn't at all exposed to civil suit in this case, as long as they discipline (fire) the officer. That's why the policy against chokeholds is in place. The department in this case has done everything right. Any civil suit win will only apply to the officer, now fired and unable to pay.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    The point isn't to discuss the case or the actions of the police. The point is to create many what if scenarios and use them to justify the actions of the police.
    What if you presented those videos you claimed exist that fill in the missing piece of the arrest video? Still waiting.

    I'd just hate to think you are making crap up to support your argument.
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Because it's not a process that yields the greatest evidence exposure to the jury. It only yields the evidence then competing attorneys think will help them win their case. Again, the grand jurors can question the witnesses.

    But really, your question betrays that you still haven't bothered to learn and understand the process involved.
    No, you just keep posting the same crap about New York GJs, which has no semblance to reality. The GJ sees and hears only what the prosecutor tells them, can only consider charges the prosecutor brings up, only can read laws and rules the prosecutor reads to them, and only see or hear what the prosecutor wants them to hear and see.

    Your presentation of what a GJ does and can do is - every time you post it - false and naļve. Your messages are your just posting over and over than anyone who a prosecutor says is guilty is guilty, and everyone a prosecutor says committed no crime didn't. It's that simple about NY grand juries.

    Who says so includes judges of New York who claim grand juries should simply be eliminated as they serve no purpose whatsoever.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    What was the GJ jury shown by the DA? Anything? Give the list and I'll show you what else I know.

    GJs indict everyone a NY prosecutor tells them to and indict no one the prosecutor doesn't want indicted. That's just the statistical fact.
    Are you fracking serious? I'm not the one claiming that I have more information that the Grand Jury. If you don't know what information was given the grand jury, or withheld, then you can't claim you know more than they did.

    Also, please show me the statistics on outcomes of GJs that DAs want to prosecute versus those they don't want to prosecute. If it is a "statistical fact" then you should be able to find those numbers. I'll be waiting for your information, maybe you can get some help from Hatuey. His video and your statistics are likely hiding in the same dark orifice.
    Last edited by jmotivator; 12-04-14 at 05:32 PM.
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    What if you presented those videos you claimed exist that fill in the missing piece of the arrest video? Still waiting.

    I'd just hate to think you are making crap up to support your argument.
    Since YOU claim he was told he was under arrest, prove it. That is your singular justification, isn't it? If a person "resists" - then the person can be violent assaulted including lethally.

    So prove "resists" arrest - which then means you have to prove "arrest."

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    What if you presented those videos you claimed exist that fill in the missing piece of the arrest video? Still waiting
    I'd just hate to think you are making crap up to support your argument.


    Are you talking about thr garner video?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Are you fracking serious? I'm not the one claiming that I have more information that the Grand Jury. If you don't know what information was given the grand jury, or withheld, then you can't claim you know more than they did.
    No, you claimed the grand jury had more information than I do, proving none of that. What I proved is there was no filter between what I can learn, hear, read and see - and there was for the grand jury. It was not limited to what one person who didn't want a prosecution wanted me to see and hear.

    The NY GJ system is 100% worthless, a scam, a waste, nothing. Why don't you read up on it rather than raving of the grand jury system?

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, you just keep posting the same crap about New York GJs, which has no semblance to reality. The GJ sees and hears only what the prosecutor tells them, can only consider charges the prosecutor brings up, only can read laws and rules the prosecutor reads to them, and only see or hear what the prosecutor wants them to hear and see.

    Your presentation of what a GJ does and can do is - every time you post it - false and naļve. Your messages are your just posting over and over than anyone who a prosecutor says is guilty is guilty, and everyone a prosecutor says committed no crime didn't. It's that simple about NY grand juries.

    Who says so includes judges of New York who claim grand juries should simply be eliminated as they serve no purpose whatsoever.
    So funny, you talk as if you know what the process entails and then demonstrate quite clearly you do not. The grand jury does not determine guilt or innocence. You'd know that if you knew what you were talking about. Are you asserting that grand jurors cannot question the witnesses? Are you saying grand jurors cannot question the prosecutor about the evidence presented?

    Your little dodge to the superfluous comment tossed out by a NYC judge that "grand juries will indict a ham sandwich.." further demonstrates you don't understand why grand juries are called in the first place.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, you just keep posting the same crap about New York GJs, which has no semblance to reality. The GJ sees and hears only what the prosecutor tells them, can only consider charges the prosecutor brings up, only can read laws and rules the prosecutor reads to them, and only see or hear what the prosecutor wants them to hear and see.

    Your presentation of what a GJ does and can do is - every time you post it - false and naļve. Your messages are your just posting over and over than anyone who a prosecutor says is guilty is guilty, and everyone a prosecutor says committed no crime didn't. It's that simple about NY grand juries.

    Who says so includes judges of New York who claim grand juries should simply be eliminated as they serve no purpose whatsoever.
    False and naive is a kind way to say, completely ignorant of the facts....
    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, you claimed the grand jury had more information than I do, proving none of that. What I proved is there was no filter between what I can learn, hear, read and see - and there was for the grand jury. It was not limited to what one person who didn't want a prosecution wanted me to see and hear.

    The NY GJ system is 100% worthless, a scam, a waste, nothing. Why don't you read up on it rather than raving of the grand jury system?
    But there is a filter, that you fail to recognize. Prior to the final disposition of the DA's determination there is a lot of evidence not released to the public. The GJ sees this evidence.

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