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Thread: No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

  1. #1161
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    How would you have handled it? Be specific.

    What different laws?
    Give him a ticket.

    And, not kill him.

    Seems simple.
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    If a guy gets pulled over for a DUI, I'd prefer if the cops didn't just kill him.
    Thats that "I know the answer is gonna suck so I'm not going to answer it" answer.

    The cops didnt 'kill him'. He resisted arrest, they arrested him, and because he resisted arrest, his morbidly obese body gave out on him.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    As I understand it, the police were enforcing the civil tax law because these were untaxed cigarettes he was selling. I'm guessing NYC would have saved a lot of money by just letting him sell his cigarettes.
    Power is more important than money.
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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Well, that's my point. The cops claims are entirely left unsupported even if the cops should be able to find this red shirted fellow that apparently bought untaxed cigarettes, and yet, that red shirted individual is no where to be found. Telling.

    As for your point, I don't happen to agree with them being able to arrest people without informing them.
    Which is dealt with after the person is taken into custody. Right or wrong, if the police came to my door claiming I had killed someone and they put me under arrest for it, I shouldn't resist even if I know they are wrong. Especially if they have some evidence that could have been used against me that shows probable cause that is later found to be wrong. The reason is because police are given the benefit of the doubt. The trial is where the accused gets the benefit of the doubt, not during the arrest.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    How the holy-hell is ANY of this relevant to the fact that the officer's chokehold and subsequent police dogpile led to Garner's death? I don't care if he's standing with one foot in the grave, their actions pushed him over the edge and killed him.
    Yep. It damned sure killed him.

    Of course it was his actions that caused the cops to "dogpile" him and that basic tactic is used regularly by law enforcement across the country. The end result? Death by tragic accident, not murder.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    They will tell you "resisting arrest."

    It reminds me of an old book I read in which a coroner admitted he recorded every person killed by police in a police shootout as "suicide" - because in his view shooting at the police is an act of suicide - therefore no such person had ever been killed by police.

    Now "resisting arrest" is a biological cause of death to many police groupies, which, of course, is nonsensical.
    WHo would tell you he died of 'resisting arrest'? Thats just silly. He had to have died of some form or cardio or respiratory failure. What did he die of?

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    How the holy-hell is ANY of this relevant to the fact that the officer's chokehold and subsequent police dogpile led to Garner's death? I don't care if he's standing with one foot in the grave, their actions pushed him over the edge and killed him.
    Because if the decision is made that a 6'3" 360lb man needs to be subdued then that is pretty much how you need to do it if the man is healthy. Otherwise to are just asking for a beating.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Which is dealt with after the person is taken into custody. Right or wrong, if the police came to my door claiming I had killed someone and they put me under arrest for it, I shouldn't resist even if I know they are wrong. Especially if they have some evidence that could have been used against me that shows probable cause that is later found to be wrong. The reason is because police are given the benefit of the doubt. The trial is where the accused gets the benefit of the doubt, not during the arrest.
    Yeah great, and it's well after the event and the cops still haven't turned up evidence of the existence of the red shirted individual in their story. The dude is apparently a ghost because they can't find him or something. Sorry, but I'm calling bull**** on their story.

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    No, he died because of the actions police took. That's why it was called homicide. Do you disagree? Or are you done claiming it was asthma and weight?
    Seems you and Joko are like minded. Maybe you two together can come up with the actual cause of death. He also is going with homicide but offered the countering position of dying of 'resisting arrest'. So...you know...two heads....maybe you can come up with an actual answer.

    What did he die of?

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    Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    You lie through omission. You conveniently left out his asthma, his diabetes and his advanced heart disease.

    In the end, Gardener was amazing frail and literally near death and his 6'3" 360LB frame gave the exact opposite impression. It was that false impression that led to the officer's choices on how to detain Gardener. Had he been a relatively healthy then a combative 6'3" 360LB Gardener would probably be more than the officers could handle.
    Do... you ... realize... that "if he was like this" is not a defense for using excessive force on another human being? Like if a woman and a man get into a fight... and the man ends up beating her to within an inch of life... the defends himself saying: "If she had been a man of the same physical condition, she'd have put a better fight" will not get him out of prison time.... right?
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