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Thread: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    "A hate crime is a traditional offense like murder, arson, or vandalism with an added element of bias" now please explain how you can commit a hate crime without a bias towards the victim.
    because the link proves you wrong, you might want to read more of it . . . . . ill wait
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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    because the link proves you wrong, you might want to read more of it . . . . . ill wait
    There's no right or wrong here there's me asking you how a hate crime can exist without bias now please answer the question

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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    There's no right or wrong here there's me asking you how a hate crime can exist without bias now please answer the question
    no there is definitely a right or wrong and your assumption is factually wrong and being inconsistent and moving the goal post and back pedalling wont change that

    here is your question:"Can you be charged with a hate crime without a bias towards the victims identity"

    the factual answer is yes

    do you disagree with that answer?
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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    no there is definitely a right or wrong and your assumption is factually wrong and being inconsistent and moving the goal post and back pedalling wont change that

    here is your question:"Can you be charged with a hate crime without a bias towards the victims identity"

    the factual answer is yes

    do you disagree with that answer?
    I do disagree with that answer and I'm asking you how so please answer the question. How can you be charged with a hate crime without any bias towards the victims identity. You "accused me" of question dodging and now you're not answering.

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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    1.)I do disagree with that answer
    2.) and I'm asking you how so please answer the question.
    3.) How can you be charged with a hate crime without any bias towards the victims identity. You "accused me" of question dodging and now you're not answering.
    1.) and you are factually wrong
    2.) already provided the link, READ IT lol
    3.) that is a lie since i did answer. Not my fault you cant understand it, all you have to do is read the definition of hate crime and you will see the answer to your question:

    "Can you be charged with a hate crime without a bias towards the victims identity"
    the answer is yes

    here ill help you since you are too lazy or dont understand

    heres a qoute from the link that prove its not a thought crime and the answer is yes

    "Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties."
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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) and you are factually wrong
    2.) already provided the link, READ IT lol
    3.) that is a lie since i did answer. Not my fault you cant understand it, all you have to do is read the definition of hate crime and you will see the answer to your question:

    "Can you be charged with a hate crime without a bias towards the victims identity"
    the answer is yes

    here ill help you since you are too lazy or dont understand

    heres a qoute from the link that prove its not a thought crime and the answer is yes

    "Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties."

    "Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties."

    So you need to be motivated by a bias against a race, religion .etc .etc but you don't need to have a bias towards the identity of the victim. Ok show me an example of a hate crime where someone can be motivated by his personal bias but not motivated with a bias towards the victims identity
    Last edited by Libertie76; 12-03-14 at 10:48 AM.

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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    "Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties."

    So you need to be motivated by a bias against a race, religion .etc .etc but you don't need to have a bias towards the identity of the victim. Ok show me an example of a hate crime where someone can be motivated by his personal bias but not motivated with a bias towards the victims identity
    read it again because you are wrong, focus on the words "A" and "property" and then read your question as you asked it.

    the answer is yes and that fact will not change
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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) and you are factually wrong
    2.) already provided the link, READ IT lol
    3.) that is a lie since i did answer. Not my fault you cant understand it, all you have to do is read the definition of hate crime and you will see the answer to your question:

    "Can you be charged with a hate crime without a bias towards the victims identity"
    the answer is yes

    here ill help you since you are too lazy or dont understand

    heres a qoute from the link that prove its not a thought crime and the answer is yes

    "Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties."
    Let me put it to you simply. You have to prove personal bias in a hate crime case through court proceedings. Effectively if it becomes the nature of the trial to prove that he committed a hate crime, crime motivated by personal bias, then it becomes the nature of the trial to prove the ideology and opinions of the person. In order to prove that you need to understand the thoughts and opinions of the perpetrator.

    The illegal action of a the crime is on trial yes, but having a hate crime charge further suggests that the motivation based on the perpetrators ideology is illegal more so then just the act itself. In a sense it's illegal to attack some one, and it's illegal to be motivated by your own personal bias in the action of attacking the individual. This is how it is a thought crime. Your personal bias gets put on trial, not to simply discuss the motivation to prove you intentionally harmed the individual, but that the fact that your motivation of being biased was also illegal as well.

    With that being said it violates the 14th amendment because it protects a certain group of victims more so on the basis of motivation then it does to others. Effectively I could be shot by a crazy white guy who is biased towards blacks, but if a black guy is shot by a white guy with the white guy showing a bias towards blacks the black guy is now protected more favorably under the federal government, which is a contradiction towards the 14th amendment of the equal protection clause.

    I know I know your going to tell me I'm wrong, but the fact still remains the minute you charge someone with a hate crime, the persons political or religious beliefs and opinions become the scope of the trial, this is how hate crime legislation is actually thought crime legislation.

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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    read it again because you are wrong, focus on the words "A" and "property" and then read your question as you asked it.

    the answer is yes and that fact will not change
    Ok no example given nice question dodge

  10. #110
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    Re: Utah man gets maximum sentence in hate crime case

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    1.) Let me put it to you simply. You have to prove personal bias in a hate crime case through court proceedings. Effectively if it becomes the nature of the trial to prove that he committed a hate crime, crime motivated by personal bias, then it becomes the nature of the trial to prove the ideology and opinions of the person. In order to prove that you need to understand the thoughts and opinions of the perpetrator.
    2.)The illegal action of a the crime is on trial yes, but having a hate crime charge further suggests that the motivation based on the perpetrators ideology is illegal more so then just the act itself. In a sense it's illegal to attack some one, and it's illegal to be motivated by your own personal bias in the action of attacking the individual. This is how it is a thought crime. Your personal bias gets put on trial, not to simply discuss the motivation to prove you intentionally harmed the individual, but that the fact that your motivation of being biased was also illegal as well.
    3.)With that being said it violates the 14th amendment because it protects a certain group of victims more so on the basis of motivation then it does to others. Effectively I could be shot by a crazy white guy who is biased towards blacks, but if a black guy is shot by a white guy with the white guy showing a bias towards blacks the black guy is now protected more favorably under the federal government, which is a contradiction towards the 14th amendment of the equal protection clause.
    4.)I know I know your going to tell me I'm wrong, but the fact still remains the minute you charge someone with a hate crime, the persons political or religious beliefs and opinions become the scope of the trial, this is how hate crime legislation is actually thought crime legislation.
    1.) which doesnt change the fact that the answer to YOUR question is yes
    2.) this is nothing more than you opinion that you cant back up with any facts and that many other laws are based on
    3.) theres no argument for that what so ever, if you disagree simply show me the link, law, rights, court cases that support it
    4.) not me. Law, rights, facts and the definition of those laws prove you wrong . . . remind us what you have supporting your claims besides "nu-huh and yeah-huh"

    good luck and let us know when you can prove, using facts its a thought crime and magically different lol
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