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Thread: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    That's your opinion...We shall have to wait and see if that is indeed the case...I suspect no.
    So I take it you're declaring that deferring deportations is something new? Yes?
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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    So I take it you're declaring that deferring deportations is something new? Yes?
    Not at all...Are you declaring that Obama is just doing exactly what Reagan did?
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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    An example which is irrelevant to the point being made? Got it.



    It's a stupid argument to argue that there is precedent for this (both recent and historical) and as such Congress will have a hard time arguing it is illegal. Got it. Do you know how this country works?
    It's a stupid argument to argue that precedence matters here. This is not the judicial branch where precedence matters where it comes to legality and constitutionality.

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    It's a stupid argument to argue that precedence matters here. This is not the judicial branch where precedence matters where it comes to legality and constitutionality.
    Congress shall have no problem arguing it's illegal then won't they? Except...

    Think Obama Is Behaving Like A Dictator On Immigration? SCOTUS Would Very Much Beg To Differ - Forbes

    Quote Originally Posted by Justice Kennedy
    “Congress has specified which aliens may be removed from the United States and the procedures for doing so. Aliens may be removed if they were inadmissible at the time of entry, have been convicted of certain crimes, or meet other criteria set by federal law. Removal is a civil, not criminal, matter. A principal feature of the removal system is the broad discretion exercise by immigration officials (emphasis added). Federal officials, as an initial matter, must decide whether it makes sense to pursue removal at all. If removal proceedings commence, aliens may seek asylum and other discretionary relief allowing them to remain in the country or at least to leave without formal removal.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    And you have no idea how to resolve the issue, any more than you have any idea of how to run a nation without levying taxes.
    I'm not really interesting in a solution to that problem, but you know I'm right. The system of checks and balances is laughably stupid. It is perhaps the dumbest idea the founders had.

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Congress shall have no problem arguing it's illegal then won't they? Except...

    Think Obama Is Behaving Like A Dictator On Immigration? SCOTUS Would Very Much Beg To Differ - Forbes
    So, I see you've ceded the silly precedence argument and have moved on. Now read my bold on the same quote for your answer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Justice Kennedy

    “Congress has specified which aliens may be removed from the United States and the procedures for doing so. Aliens may be removed if they were inadmissible at the time of entry, have been convicted of certain crimes, or meet other criteria set by federal law. Removal is a civil, not criminal, matter. A principal feature of the removal system is the broad discretion exercise by immigration officials (emphasis added). Federal officials, as an initial matter, must decide whether it makes sense to pursue removal at all. If removal proceedings commence, aliens may seek asylum and other discretionary relief allowing them to remain in the country or at least to leave without formal removal.
    Who makes federal law? Does existing federal law say "enforcement to be determined at the discretion of the Executive"?

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Not at all...Are you declaring that Obama is just doing exactly what Reagan did?
    In 1987, President Reagan rescinded the deportation orders of 200K Nicaraguans through executive order:

    U.S. May Let Some Illegals Stay If Relatives Qualify for Amnesty - NYTimes.com

    And then changed government policy for non-citizens who'd fought in the Grenada campaign:

    Executive Order 12582
    Naturalization requirements exceptions for aliens and non-citizen nationals of the United States who served in the Grenada campaign
    As I said, I'll wait until the court cases. However, I doubt Republicans will do more than bark and then just opt to defund Obama's EO and pass a bipartisan bill.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    So, I see you've ceded the silly precedence argument and have moved on. Now read my bold on the same quote for your answer.



    Who makes federal law? Does existing federal law say "enforcement to be determined at the discretion of the Executive"?
    Hey, he doesn't want to talk about what the actual rules say. He wants to talk about SCOTUS and how they read them.

    Oh, and just for the lols Justice Kennedy was appointed by Reagan in 1988. So the guy that was trying to get away with something appointed a guy that argued in his favor. Classic.
    Last edited by Henrin; 11-21-14 at 06:36 PM.

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    So, I see you've ceded the silly precedence argument and have moved on.
    I haven't moved on to anything else. I showed why SCOTUS would back Obama on this and how precedent plays a role on the fact that it's very unlikely the GOP will get more than whining and a bill out of it.

    Now read my bold on the same quote for your answer.

    Who makes federal law? Does existing federal law say "enforcement to be determined at the discretion of the Executive"?
    What part of this is problematic for you: Federal officials, as an initial matter, must decide whether it makes sense to pursue removal at all.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Obama acts on immigration, announcing decision to defer deportations of 4 million

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    He didn't throw out the law either. Please stop the hyperbole. Obama did what presidents have had the authority to do. Don't like it? Take it up with 50+ years of similar EOs.
    I do wish you would review the history before posting something like this.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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