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Thread: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

  1. #281
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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    You are making inferences here-jumps-that should not be made. Maliki TOLD Obama to make it an executive agreement, to sidestep the difficulties in getting a sofa agreement.

    And in truth, a better president wouldn't have had any trouble getting through an agreement but as we see demonstrated nearly daily, our POTUS is not such a good leader.
    It's like you didn't read your own source, what part of no senior official in the Iraqi government was willing to support extraterritoriality is hard for you to understand? It's like you're not even reading your own sources. You proved your own claim wrong. There was no inference. The Iraqi government would not have allowed extraterritoriality, they would not budge, and the people of the US would have had a collective meltdown if it had been agreed to. That makes your entire claim not only ridiculous, but false. They had no intention of 'working with us' if extraterritoriality was a position they (that includes Maliki) would not budge on.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    It's like you didn't read your own source, what part of no senior official in the Iraqi government was willing to support extraterritoriality is hard for you to understand? It's like you're not even reading your own sources. You proved your own claim wrong. There was no inference. The Iraqi government would not have allowed extraterritoriality, they would not budge, and the people of the US would have had a collective meltdown if it had been agreed to. That makes your entire claim not only ridiculous, but false. They had no intention of 'working with us' if extraterritoriality was a position they (that includes Maliki) would not budge on.
    I have already linked to where Maliki ASKED OBAMA TO STAY. My claim was Iraq WANTED THE US TO STAY.
    Obama left anyway and lost the peace in Iraq. Own it.

  3. #283
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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    I have already linked to where Maliki ASKED OBAMA TO STAY. My claim was Iraq WANTED THE US TO STAY.
    Obama left anyway and lost the peace in Iraq. Own it.
    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Iraq was willing to work with us
    Still lying about what you stated? Again, Iraq didn't want to work with us. They asked to stay with the condition that we'd give up extraterritoriality. Not only was that unfeasible, it proves they had no interest in us staying at all. Keep lying US Con. Maybe if you do it long enough, it will come true.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  4. #284
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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    I have already linked to where Maliki ASKED OBAMA TO STAY. My claim was Iraq WANTED THE US TO STAY.
    Obama left anyway and lost the peace in Iraq. Own it.
    There was no peace, with Maliki in charge, it is/was a powder keg ready to blow.


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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Hey at least you can come out and say it-you were willing to leave Iraq to the wolves if it suited you. It wasn't about Iraq for Obama either-it was about how to take full advantage of the situation for political capital.

    Now, since you and I agree something should now be done-the question is WHAT. We know that a few airstrikes here or there make for good news coverage but they aren't substantive. Boots on the ground are. And since we should never fight a war without being willing to fight it-I think we should deploy forces first to expel ISIS, and then to maintain a limited security presence for as long as is needed-NOT until a date on a calendar is reached.
    Too many mistakes were made early on that turned tactical convenience into insurmountable strategic failures. We would have needed McCain's 100 year war to even make a decent showing of it. It wasn't about throwing people to the wolves. We failed and needed to cut our losses. AMERICA failed, not Obama, and we failed before most people ever heard the name Obama in their lives.

    Despite your rhetoric trying to avoid admitting the above making me not even want to discuss it further with you, I will say this: What we should do depends on what one wants the post war region to realistically look like--the only two choices are religious oligarchy or somewhat secular autocracy. The only in-between is biding time until you have one or the other at a great human toll.

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    I have already linked to where Maliki ASKED OBAMA TO STAY. My claim was Iraq WANTED THE US TO STAY.
    Obama left anyway and lost the peace in Iraq. Own it.
    The immunities issue was always a condition of United States forces remaining in Iraq. Why can you not comprehend this?

    Now, if your argument is that we should have stayed, extraterritoriality be damned, then fine, make the argument. It's a dumb argument, but at least it's an argument, not a steadfast denial of facts that are in your own source.
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    The immunities issue was always a condition of United States forces remaining in Iraq. Why can you not comprehend this?

    Now, if your argument is that we should have stayed, extraterritoriality be damned, then fine, make the argument. It's a dumb argument, but at least it's an argument, not a steadfast denial of facts that are in your own source.
    We could have brought down the Maliki government had we wanted to stay. Your thinking seems to be too post hoc ergo propter hoc on this.

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    What now? We focus on what NEEDS to be done, and thats boots on the ground, not a dog an pony show of airstrikes that aren't definitive.
    In medicine, you treat the cause of the problems-and the symptoms resolve.
    ISIS is a symptom of a weak leader who WONT act. Said another way, this dog wont hunt.
    I think we have established that there is no support for any decision Obama makes. And you want to put Soldiers in harms way? Hell no. Not with that kind of support.

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Declan View Post
    We could have brought down the Maliki government had we wanted to stay. Your thinking seems to be too post hoc ergo propter hoc on this.
    You mean the government we were trying to legitimize?
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    Re: US hostage Kassig 'killed by IS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dog View Post
    That must have taken all of what? 3 seconds to come up with? Much like the other poster... Why don't you come up with a real argument and stop wasting my time.
    I guess you've forgotten that you are not required to answer every posting you disagree with. In fact, you don't even have to read the thread. Now I've reminded you of this, do try and remember.

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