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Thread: Stupidity of the American Voter?

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    If there is anyone who should know about making minimum wage....its a Texan (Capital of the minimum wage worker....oh sorry....tied with Mississippi for that honor).
    Hey, Disney, how about those election results in November?? Guess the American electorate isn't as stupid as Gruber believed but then again wonder how many in California he studied?

    Keep spreading that false information ignoring that California has more than triple the number of people making minimum wage as TX and the cost of living is much higher. When will you admit that distort the data and ignore the California minimum wage? Could it be that Gruber was right?

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Good



    I've addressed this before with other studies, and challenged you to note specific regulations, to which you have never responded. So for this one, I'll site a source that links or mentions a couple of studies: Heritage isn't the only one making this argument. A Phoenix Foundation study claimed that, "a 5 percent reduction in the federal regulatory budget would yield 5.9 million new jobs over five years." But the Public Citizen report points out that this leads to a ludicrous conclusion: "a 16 percent decrease (a figure the authors chose to parallel the amount by which they say federal spending had exceeded revenue since 2000) would result in the creation of 18.8 million new jobs over five years. In contrast, there are only about 11.3 million unemployed Americans."

    Regulations Don't Kill Jobs, They Save Lives*|*Sean McElwee
    For the record I am not against all regulation, but do you really believe that we need thousands new ones per year?

    "For generations, economic liberty and dynamism defined America and set us apart from the rest of the world. Now, if a new study from the Brookings Institution is right, it’s fading rapidly into a memory."

    - See more at: Overregulation Is Killing America

    Please read this, it says it far better than I can...

    These have minimal effects at best. Largely promoting business and not hurting. Taxation is something I have given you studies on that show little to no effect and have linked you to Forbes arguing that conservatives were wrong on this. I can link them again if you want. But, the key is here, these are not emotional arguments, but factual ones, with support.

    But for your reading pleasure:

    If you increase the tax rates on these job creators, then the tax that they pay on everything EXCEPT jobs will go up. They still won't have to pay taxes on the money that they spend for employee compensation. A tax increase will give them an incentive to invest in the business, because it is the cost of NOT investing that goes up, not the cost of investing. It won't give them an incentive NOT to invest in job creation. This will not be an incentive for killing jobs - this will be an incentive for creating
    jobs - take money out of the column that is taxable, put it in the column that is not taxable. Simple mathematics. Not political rhetoric, but mathematics.

    If you decrease the tax rates on these job creators, then there will be no added incentive to create jobs. The taxes paid on employee benefits for these job creators is zero either way. What this does is decrease the taxes that they have to pay on the money that they aren't using to create jobs anyway. The cost of paying for jobs does not go up, but the cost of NOT creating jobs goes down. It is an incentive for them to keep more profits that are taxable. It is in no way an incentive for them to spend the money on job creation. Again, mathematics, not rhetoric.

    If you don't understand the previous four paragraphs, please re-read them, because this is important to our economy today.

    Taxing the Job Creators:What Is the Truth? - Economics Online Tutor
    So you want to use taxation as a blunt tool to force business to hire....this just shows how little you know about business.
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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    If employers are winning why are so many corporations leaving the country? Why are businesses suffering? In fact any business person can tell you the answer but the theorists don't want to listen.

    The current president has never been in any business in his life yet seems to know what business is all about and can even give millions of taxpayer dollars to start-up companies of which he also knows nothing. Or feels he can decide who banks lend their money to. It's people who have no knowledge of business who want more rules, regulations and, in doing so, drive out all business from their areas.
    No, you have none.


    After having been in business for two decades, I can say that in a room full of MBA's and lawyers, experience is king. When you have to, by law and morality, make payroll with YOUR money, things change. When you have to tell the kids, 'no, we can't afford that..." because YOU made zero that week in order to pay your staff you lose a lot of sleep. When you have to sit across from a friend and fellow worker and tell him there is no more work for him because some brainless vote buying asshole has ****ed up the economy again, you become more sympathetic to the plight of joblessness, as when you have to lay people off, and "guarantee" your job would be there is in serious doubt.

    Mr. Obama has never had a private sector job, his life has been all through the taxpayer one way or another....that separates him from me more than does the pacific separate me from Japan. He is inexperienced, incompetent, and arrogant enough to be dangerously stubborn.

    The government claims there is no big issue, that not that many jobs are leaving the country, and people there believe it, while here, Ottawa boasts of all the American companies moving to Canada especially since Obamacare; one of the appealing aspects of locating here is universal health care, where the taxes and wages are about the same, they have no mandate they have to meet, therefor they can use that money elsewhere.

    These are called "unforeseen circumstances" by some, but "downstream run off" to the economists, MBA's and businessmen who have had to lay people off.
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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Hey, Disney, how about those election results in November?? Guess the American electorate isn't as stupid as Gruber believed but then again wonder how many in California he studied?

    Keep spreading that false information ignoring that California has more than triple the number of people making minimum wage as TX and the cost of living is much higher. When will you admit that distort the data and ignore the California minimum wage? Could it be that Gruber was right?
    LOL...Con...its always fun to watch you shuffle and dance around the facts. I know if makes you uncomfortable knowing that Texas (and Mississippi) have the worst record in the country on people working for minimum wage....straight out of those BLS numbers you love so much (well...maybe not love so much when the numbers don't match your rhetoric).
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL...Con...its always fun to watch you shuffle and dance around the facts. I know if makes you uncomfortable knowing that Texas (and Mississippi) have the worst record in the country on people working for minimum wage....straight out of those BLS numbers you love so much (well...maybe not love so much when the numbers don't match your rhetoric).
    BLS gives those working at or below the FEDERAL minimum wage. Several states, including California, have minimum wages higher than the Federal min wage. Therefore very few Calfiornia workers will make the Federal min wage and will not be represented in the BLS data.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    [QUOTE=j-mac;1064041776]
    For the record I am not against all regulation, but do you really believe that we need thousands new ones per year?

    "For generations, economic liberty and dynamism defined America and set us apart from the rest of the world. Now, if a new study from the Brookings Institution is right, itís fading rapidly into a memory."

    - See more at: Overregulation Is Killing America

    Please read this, it says it far better than I can...
    I don't know and I think you or Edward Morrissey does either. The point is, without looking at specific regulation, we can't make a blanket statement. And I think that's the trick being used here. It's easier to say too much, and shoot a number than to break down each legislative effort to see if it is justified or not. So, if I don't want to do that work, or I want to merely get a mob behind me, I don't get specific. Generalizations are far easier. I think that is what Morrissey is doing in the editorial you offered. Oddly effort, the article I gave you suggests regulations are just what he says he wants done: "Put simply, business failures enable resources to be unlocked for the use of more efficient and successful businesses."

    You see having to do things differently inspires innovation and not the opposite.



    So you want to use taxation as a blunt tool to force business to hire....this just shows how little you know about business.
    No where did I say that. I'm saying it doesn't hurt economy or cost jobs. It's a clear and direct statement.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    BLS gives those working at or below the FEDERAL minimum wage. Several states, including California, have minimum wages higher than the Federal min wage. Therefore very few Calfiornia workers will make the Federal min wage and will not be represented in the BLS data.
    Then by definition....they are making more than the Federal Minimum wage. Bottom line...Texas and Mississippi have the worst record in the nation for people working for minimum wages.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Then by definition....they are making more than the Federal Minimum wage. Bottom line...Texas and Mississippi have the worst record in the nation for people working for minimum wages.
    And yet, despite the higher wages in California, it does have the highest supplemental poverty rate in the Nation. Even more than D.C.. An accomplishment Proglibs can most certainly be proud of.

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    [QUOTE=Boo Radley;1064042262]
    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post

    I don't know and I think you or Edward Morrissey does either. The point is, without looking at specific regulation, we can't make a blanket statement. And I think that's the trick being used here. It's easier to say too much, and shoot a number than to break down each legislative effort to see if it is justified or not. So, if I don't want to do that work, or I want to merely get a mob behind me, I don't get specific. Generalizations are far easier. I think that is what Morrissey is doing in the editorial you offered. Oddly effort, the article I gave you suggests regulations are just what he says he wants done: "Put simply, business failures enable resources to be unlocked for the use of more efficient and successful businesses."
    REGULATION NATION: Obama oversees expansion of the regulatory state | TheHill

    All the experts say that regulation is smothering business activity...That you think somehow it doesn't matter is laughable.

    You see having to do things differently inspires innovation and not the opposite.
    Once again by the force of government...Not through efficiency, or making things better....You're confusing innovation with being forced to do something....But I understand, you see government as the answer.

    No where did I say that.
    Really?

    So when you said - "A tax increase will give them an incentive to invest in the business, because it is the cost of NOT investing that goes up, not the cost of investing. " How can that not be taken as anything other than government forcing business to hire if they don't want to get taxed....?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Stupidity of the American Voter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, when you work for someone you earn the pay. You work and the employer gives you pay. You've earned it, but it is given from the employer. No one called it a gift or unearned. And we are the government. By electing representatives, they can vote in our name.
    We are not the government. What an idiotic thing to say. Unless you are one of the two million busybody bureaucrats hired to spy on us, harass us with IRS questions/audits or the EPA to de-industrialize the nation you are not the government.

    Government is evil. Most people are not. I can make an exception in your case if you want to continue to believe you are the government.

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