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Thread: Employment Situation Report for October

  1. #61
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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by Visbek View Post
    Erm... The claim is that wages haven't kept up with productivity growth. You're missing something....
    Nothing is missing. You just don't understand what Unit Labour Cost measures.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Oh...wages and salaries of all divided by productivity. Uh, doesn't show wage gains of low/mid workers in relation to their productivity, the context of the argument.
    You asked for a chart that tracked wages and productivity. I gave you one. Where exactly did you ask for anything in relation to low/mid wage workers?

    Again, not debating in good faith, using stats to hide the issue....a typical day in vixenland.
    What isn't typical is you moving the goalpost when you are proven wrong or about to be.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    No, that is the point, "average" wages and salaries hides whether low/medium wage workers have and are seeing wage gains matching their increased productivity.
    No, it doesn't. Average Hourly Earnings also takes into account industry and sector earnings, as well as nonsupervisory employees. That already gives you an idea of the types of jobs that are seeing steady income gains, and how that effects average hourly earnings.

    And if you are going to look at average hourly earnings, it must take into account all for all wage workers, not just the ones who matter most to you.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    That makes nine straight months of job growth over 200,000. Over 10 million jobs created since the recession ended.

    Gee, if only the Democrats had a broad, winning issue they could have run on. Hmm.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    You asked for a chart that tracked wages and productivity. I gave you one. Where exactly did you ask for anything in relation to low/mid wage workers?What isn't typical is you moving the goalpost when you are proven wrong or about to be.
    Um, the context was low/mid wage workers:

    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    But increasing the minimum wage does exactly that. Unless wages above the minimum get an raise (provided that their productivity justifies their income), those jobs become the new minimum wage jobs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    I hate to break it to you, but the productivity-wage gain link was broken back @ 1980.
    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    No, it doesn't. Average Hourly Earnings also takes into account industry and sector earnings, as well as nonsupervisory employees. That already gives you an idea of the types of jobs that are seeing steady income gains, and how that effects average hourly earnings.

    And if you are going to look at average hourly earnings, it must take into account all for all wage workers, not just the ones who matter most to you.
    BS, not only is the current context low/mid wage earners and the disconnect between their gains and their productivity, but wage gains since 1980 have been skewed to upper earners. Sure, "average" wages have increased....but not for the workers under discussion. If anyone is moving goal posts, it is the poster who cannot remember what their own context was and wants to discuss all wages.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Um, the context was low/mid wage workers:
    That is a completely different conversation. The minimum wage has nothing to do with whether or not wages keeps up with productivity. If you wanted productivity/wage gains relative to low wage workers, you should have asked for it.

    You didn't, and now you are moving the goalpost in attempt to save face for a bad argument.

    BS, not only is the current context low/mid wage earners and the disconnect between their gains and their productivity, but wage gains since 1980 have been skewed to upper earners. Sure, "average" wages have increased....but not for the workers under discussion. If anyone is moving goal posts, it is the poster who cannot remember what their own context was and wants to discuss all wages.
    When you measure productivity relative to wages, you look at all wages. That's not debatable.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    That is a completely different conversation. The minimum wage has nothing to do with whether or not wages keeps up with productivity. If you wanted productivity/wage gains relative to low wage workers, you should have asked for it.You didn't, and now you are moving the goalpost in attempt to save face for a bad argument.
    No dear, it is the same conversation, it lead to you trying to show that wages have kept pace with productivity for low/mid workers. Again, you can't keep the context in mind in any debate we have, it is a recurring issue for you.





    When you measure productivity relative to wages, you look at all wages. That's not debatable.
    You look at wages for the groups under discussion, not averages that have been skewed by top wages. You want to discuss an average wage, not a median worker's wage.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    No dear, it is the same conversation, it lead to you trying to show that wages have kept pace with productivity for low/mid workers. Again, you can't keep the context in mind in any debate we have, it is a recurring issue for you.
    If you wanted statistics about mid/low wage workers, you should have asked for it. It is really not my fault you can't convey your thoughts in a coherent manner. You should really be more accountable for the words that you write.

    You look at wages for the groups under discussion, not averages that have been skewed by top wages. You want to discuss an average wage, not a median worker's wage.
    Average hourly earnings is a measure of the typical worker's income, not the top or mid/low income worker. That is also not debatable. This is important because this reflects the types of jobs being created, within the economy and within each industry.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Well, so far, nothing the Liberals have done has worked. How do you explain the failure of the Liberal agenda to encourage economic growth?
    That's your opinion. Would you rather have taken Europe's path where austerity has caused a double dip recession and continued double digit unemployment? Sometimes I believe you do. Recession are Republicans biggest "contribution" to the economy and you are jealous of the job conservatives have done there.

    the recession began on President George W. Bush's watch, and it was a consequence of the sort of lax financial regulation that Republicans (including the Reagan-appointed Fed chief, Alan Greenspan) promoted for years and, amazingly, still promoted. Some Democrats deserve blame, too--notably the Clinton-era treasury secretaries Larry Summers and Robert Rubin. But it was Republicans who pushed deregulation hardest, and who most fervently resisted extending regulatory governance to newly-evolving corners of finance. (This latter strategy, which the political scientists Jacob Hacker and Paul Pierson call "drift," has been crucial in reducing regulation generally, because in Washington it is always easier to prevent something from happening than it is to create new policy.)
    http://www.newrepublic.com/article/1...ican-recession
    Last edited by iguanaman; 11-07-14 at 05:51 PM.

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    Re: Employment Situation Report for October

    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreetVixen View Post
    If you wanted statistics about mid/low wage workers, you should have asked for it.It is really not my fault you can't convey your thoughts in a coherent manner. You should really be more accountable for the words that you write.
    Shifting the burden once again, I'm supposed to ask you to keep the debate within its context. Forget that, it is up to you keep the debate within the context....and guess what...I AM TELLING YOU TO DO SO.



    Average hourly earnings is a measure of the typical worker's income, not the top or mid/low income worker.
    No, the typical worker would be the median of the population.
    That is also not debatable.
    I have proven it is.
    This is important because this reflects the types of jobs being created, within the economy and within each industry.
    Except that....you have already conceded that the jobs being created currently are not "average wage" jobs...that is unless your argument is so deluded to believe that new employment is paying @ $24.00 per hr.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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