President Obama sent 'secret letter' to leader of Iran

cpwill said:

No - I did not say that we actively supported the Iranian government in cracking down on the Green Movement,

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No? Your post at #49

cpwill said:

Iran's mullah's were supported against their people by the Obama administration.

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Your emphasis, not mine. Only you used italics and seeing how I'm quoting you I can't italicize the already italicized so I had to use bold to show your emphasis.

cpwill said:

only that we backed them instead of the Green Movement in that conflict. You are attempting to create a strawman out of that one point (I assume) because you went and looked up the apocalyptic nature of the Twelver Shia regime in Tehran and realized that most of your other arguments were crap.

Ah. Are we at war with Russia currently due to our feeble, poor, semi-support of the Ukrainian government? How, given that Iran already perceives herself in a low-intensity war with us, do you forsee that our support for the Green Movement would neccessitate moving to a conventional kinetic conflict?

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Listen, I know you are never gonna admit you mispoke and are gonna continue to double down with every post. Let's just save us some time and end this nonsense here. Agreed?

poweRob said:

From your article that you are quoting.. (that I had to googled up)

The National Security Council staff, which coordinates U.S. defense, diplomatic and intelligence policy from inside the White House, has nearly doubled in size on his watch. It has gone from about 50 under George H.W. Bush to 100 under Bill Clinton, 200 under George W. Bush and about 370 under Obama.​

So the meetings are growing in size but shrinking at the same time?

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The number of people In Obama's immediate policy group is immaterial, especially since you have no idea what role any of them play in the decision making process. The point is that the normal machinations of government in this process have been cast aside by Obama in favor of a decision making group that he controls directly and whose deliberations are not measured by outside influence. By all accounts the diversity of opinion in Foreign affairs has been cut out of the process.

This is why we have the president sending secret messages to Iran to bypass his own government.

MMC said:

Oh and the finality to it.....until they come up with a new plan.



Tragic Setbacks for U.S. Allies in Iraq and Syria.....


Western Iraq saw more brutal bloodshed this weekend after the Islamic State massacred 322 people of the Albu Nimr tribe, a Sunni group, including women and children. The Iraqi government confirmed the attack in the Anbar region, which began on Saturday and continued into Sunday, and was described as "systematic killings."Beyond the lives lost, the success of these "systematic killings" will have a long-term impact on the struggle between ISIS and the Iraqi government. "The fall of the village dampened the Shi'ite-led national government's hopes the Sunni tribesmen of Anbar—who once helped U.S. Marines defeat al Qaeda—would become a formidable force again and help the army take on Iraq's new, far more effective enemy," noted Reuters's Michael Georgy.

In Syria, the United States faced another setback in its battle against terrorist groups, when weapons distributed to anti-government rebels ended up in the hands of an al-Qaeda splinter group, Jabhat al-Nusra. The weapons provided by the United States included GRAD rockets and TOW anti-tank missiles. It is unclear if the moderate rebels who had been trained by the United States surrendered or defected to the terrorist group. The Independent reported that a U.S.-backed rebel group, Harakat Hazm, surrendered on Saturday night "without firing a shot" after al-Nusra attacked the villages it controlled. Some soldiers apparently defected, and the Syrian Revolutionary Front, another group receiving U.S. support, was driven from its strongholds.....snip~

Tragic Setbacks for U.S. Allies in Iraq and Syria

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How tragic for those that were senselessly killed! And their God supposedly encourages this? I can't believe that - it's a man-made rule that they are following, not a religious one, IMO! Disgusting is the most polite word I can use here to express my thoughts on the savagery being perpetrated! It's okay to kill children? Even cavemen were more advanced than those jackals!

jmotivator said:

The number of people In Obama's immediate policy group is immaterial, especially since you have no idea what role any of them play in the decision making process. The point is that the normal machinations of government in this process have been cast aside by Obama in favor of a decision making group that he controls directly. By all accounts the diversity of opinion in Foreign affairs has been cut out of the process.

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Yeah... Obama should just be more bold.



Now THAT's a foreign policy.

poweRob said:

Yeah... Obama should just be more bold.



Now THAT's a foreign policy.

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jmotivator said:

The number of people In Obama's immediate policy group is immaterial, especially since you have no idea what role any of them play in the decision making process. The point is that the normal machinations of government in this process have been cast aside by Obama in favor of a decision making group that he controls directly and whose deliberations are not measured by outside influence. By all accounts the diversity of opinion in Foreign affairs has been cut out of the process.

This is why we have the president sending secret messages to Iran to bypass his own government.

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Heya JM. :2wave: As well as to the Saud and Qatar.

poweRob said:

No? Your post at #49

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Here is what I said at 49:


If you read that as saying we participated in their crackdown, then you just mis-read me and no harm no foul. But if you are going to insist that instead this conversation be about the claim that we did, then you are creating a strawman.

Listen, I know you are never gonna admit you mispoke and are gonna continue to double down with every post. Let's just save us some time and end this nonsense here. Agreed?

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:roll: I meant exactly what I said. Are you going to address the rest of the post, or continue to desperately beat a strawman?

MMC said:

Heya JM. :2wave: As well as to the Saud and Qatar.

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It's one thing to create an echo chamber within your own immediate staff. But entering discussions with Iran to give them the freedom to finish their nuclear program so that they will help fix your foreign policy disasters is atrocious, and could have been avoided if Obama wasn't actively weeding out everyone he doesn't agree with.

poweRob said:

Yeah... Obama should just be more bold.

Now THAT's a foreign policy.

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A statement so crazy and right-wing that Jesus said it.

jmotivator said:

It's one thing to create an echo chamber within your own immediate staff. But entering discussions with Iran to give them the freedom to finish their nuclear program so that they will help fix your foreign policy disasters is atrocious, and could have been avoided if Obama wasn't actively weeding out everyone he doesn't agree with.

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Yeah.....just think how all over in the ME think about now.....not being able to take out that facility with Airstrikes. Like CPW pointed out....then the Saud says they will have theirs. Which we already know they were talking to the Pakistani.

Ockham said:

I've got no problem with the use of secret back channels of communication with any country. I'm concerned more with what these letters contain and what promises Obama is making to Iran. What Obama and his team don't seem to realize is that they are absolutely horrible at negotiating..... anything. Iran will steamroll over Obama and the problem with that is, Iran may eventually get nuclear weapons. I'm not worried much about the strain on Saudi / Israel relations - once Obama is out of office and a new President comes things will reset to a degree. Iran with nukes will make the future very difficult and potentially will start the worlds first nuclear war where everyone will suffer.

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I think of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact between Hitler and Stalin.

>" Seventy-five years ago, on August 23, 1939, the USSR and Nazi Germany became allies through the Stalin-Hitler Pact. Joachim von Ribbentrop signed for Hitler and Soviet foreign minister Vyacheslav Molotov signed on behalf of Stalin. Molotov said that Hitlerism was “a matter of taste,” and that it was “not only senseless, but criminal” to wage war on Hitler “camouflaged as a fight for democracy.” Though often described as a “non-aggression pact,” the reverse was true.

he month after the Pact, Stalin and Hitler both invaded Poland, starting World War II. The Pact also gave Stalin control of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, which he retained after the war, along with other conquests such as Czechoslovakia, Hungary and what became the German Democrat Republic, the regime that made emigration an exciting experience.

While the pact was in effect, Soviet and Nazi intelligence agencies worked together and American Communists did everything in their power to keep the United States from coming to Britain’s aid. During the Pact, the Soviets murdered 22,000 Polish officers in the Katyn forest. That came at the direct order of Stalin, as Russia now acknowledges. Less well known is the reality that Stalin also handed over German Jewish Communists to Hitler’s Gestapo. At the Nuremberg trials after the war, Joachim von Ribbentrop was convicted for signing the Pact while Molotov, who signed for Stalin, sat in the accuser’s chair. So Stalin and his gang got away with it..."<
The Stalin-Hitler Pact Turns 75 | FrontPage Magazine

Breaking:

>" Several media report that Putin, at the meeting of "young historian" in Moscow defended the Hitler-Stalin pact as "not a bad idea". And French and Great Brittan are in responsibility for WW2.

"President Vladimir V. Putin
has revised his opinion of an important piece of Soviet history,
calling the 1939 Molotov-Ribbentrop pact that Moscow signed with Nazi
Germany to divide up Eastern Europe not so bad. “The Soviet Union signed
a nonaggression treaty with Germany,”
Mr. Putin said during a meeting with historians on Wednesday, according
to a Russian transcript of the meeting that the Kremlin released
Thursday..."<
Read more at LiveLeak.com - Putin says: Hitler-Stalin pact was a good thing.

shrubnose said:

I'm sure that NSA is keeping a close eye on you.

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I already took precautions Shrub. I moved my tank into the garage so it's out of sight and and went down to Chino airport and attached a phony propeller on the nose of my F-4 Phantom.

jmotivator said:

It's one thing to create an echo chamber within your own immediate staff. But entering discussions with Iran to give them the freedom to finish their nuclear program so that they will help fix your foreign policy disasters is atrocious, and could have been avoided if Obama wasn't actively weeding out everyone he doesn't agree with.

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That's exactly what he has done.

poweRob said:

Yeah... Obama should just be more bold.



Now THAT's a foreign policy.

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yes, indeed! Where do you find fault?

cpwill said:

Why is Obama so keen to reach a compromise with a guy responsible for the deaths of thousands of Americans who sponsors terror on a global scale, but not with Republicans? Who does he think are his enemies?

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How is Al Khameini "responsible for the deaths of thousands of Americans"?

MMC said:

Heya Grant. :2wave: Whats worse is.....it wasn't ISIS. It was al Nusra of AQ. They stormed the Syrian Rebels villages. The Syrian Rebels have been pretty much defeated. This is the second or 3rd time al Nusra has taken weapons from them. To top it off.....Al Nusra is now going after Hezbollah and Lebanon. In which BO just gave Lebanon arms and Hellfire Missiles.

Now the Sunni in Iraq wont fight for us.....the Shia doesn't want us in Iraq now either. Yet Tuesday BO stated.....It was to early to tell about the Strategy with ISIS. :doh

Naturally the Election covered that up. http://www.debatepolitics.com/war-t...eatens-strikes-against-hezbollah-lebanon.html

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It's just pathetic, MMC. And BHO will never get a 'coalition' together, or display any leadership..He's just not capable.

The Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl saga and now a secret letter to Iran's Khamenei.

Obama has a chronic habit of excluding the US Congress.

Simpleχity;1063959603 said:

The Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl saga and now a secret letter to Iran's Khamenei.

Obama has a chronic habit of excluding the US Congress.

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And favoring America's enemies.

TheDemSocialist said:

Read more @: President Obama sent 'secret letter' to leader of Iran

No news on what exactly the letter stated. But more news coming in that the Obama administration has opened some other channel of communications as well. Would be interesting to see what the letter said. But anyways, I have no problem with this. I think the US and Iran should communicate more. [/FONT][/COLOR]

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We need to quit harassing them about their energy program.

Kobie said:

How is Al Khameini "responsible for the deaths of thousands of Americans"?

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the Iranians were behind the introduction of superior arms, training, support, and even fighters to the Mahdi Army and like groups. The EFP is only the most famous example. The majority of our casualties in Iraq can be laid either directly or indirectly at their feet. They were extremely effective engaging us with UW mechanisms.

I see no issue with a temporary tactical alliance with Iran to counter ISIS in Iraq. However, any long-term strategic partnership should have the preconditions of an elimination of Iran's nuclear program, the end of their support for Assad and terrorist groups, the termination of their hostility towards Israel, and - if we can achieve it - the liberalization of Iran's government. From our end, we should kick the MEK out of Nevada and extend diplomatic recognition to Iran.