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Thread: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC [W:110]

  1. #161
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    Re: Doctor rushed to Bellevue Hospital with Ebola symptoms went bowling a day earlier

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurmugeon View Post
    Yes, and winning is the ONLY thing that counts for them. Killing a few people, or even allot of people, who are in their way, would not matter.

    A vaccine for Ebola exists, and has existed from the better part of the Obama Administration. For some odd reason, it was never complete ( we are told ) and deployed, even to Africa.

    It could be that they view Ebola only though a Political lens....

    Or, they might actually all be truly immune to the disease...

    Where their political opponents are NOT!


    Look again, Carefully, at WHO is supremely confident that Ebola is not a threat, and scoffs at, ridicules, and belittles anyone who takes it as a serious threat.

    What is the Lean of those who dismiss Ebola as a threat?

    Who is NOT casually dismissing Ebola?

    Why is it, only people of a Far Left Political Lean are so confident?

    -

    Zzz...

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I'm not sure I do agree. We don't take proactive steps to isolate/quarantine HIV positive individuals, for example, because it's not airborne and there is no evidence the disease spreads by incidental contact. Healthcare workers take precautions and sometimes still contract HIV from their patients, but there is no general public freak out when this occurs.
    The issue is comparing other diseases to Ebola is apples and oranges. Address Ebola as an individual disease not "like" anything else because it isn't like anything else.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    And if you take steps that imply the disease spreads by touching the same door knob as a person, you get irrational panic like the school who put the teacher on leave for just being in Dallas - I don't see how that helps the situation. If it changes going forward, then obviously policies change. But that's a big "IF."
    Given all the information and misinformation I would choose to lower the risk and put proactive steps in place to protect the populace. By NOT taking proactive steps, you invite potential disaster, panic and death. I would take that risk for myself but not when I would be responsible and accountable for other people's lives.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Doctor rushed to Bellevue Hospital with Ebola symptoms went bowling a day earlier

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    America is not in "full blown 'freak out' mode".
    Then why is a doctor who treated sick and dying patients in Africa getting Ebola more than an interesting news item? Have you seen some of the posts on this thread?

    The great majority of Americans have intelligent real concerns about Ebola.
    I'm not mocking people, but the 'intelligent real concerns' are generally based on irrational fears. How many cases in the U.S., with more than 300 million people? How many did NOT involve someone treating sick and dying Ebola patients? None. So a disease that has infected not one person who wasn't in intimate contact with an Ebola patient while sick (or dead in the case of the Dallas case) requires mandatory 21 or 42 day medical isolation quarantines, travel bans, etc.? How far do we take this? Should we shut down interstates going in and out of Texas? Isolate NYC?

    Those mocking those intelligent real concerns are both 1) thereby facilitating the very panic they'd prefer not to happen, and 2) mocking because they're afraid of repercussions of Ebola toward their political power allies.
    No, political considerations have nothing to do with this. Or at least there is no more basis in that YOU disagree with my conclusions only because you don't like Obama and want democrats to lose in November. This "it's all political" finger can't point just one direction. If we're supposedly downplaying fears to help Obama, it's obvious cranking them up must help GOPers.

    Those mockers would do well to stop mocking .. and show some intelligent sensitivity.
    I think it is intelligent to point to the state of the medical science at this point, which indicates the risk to the general population is exceedingly low.

    As to Ebola becoming airborne, we know it can so mutate, we just don't know when, but, we do know what causes it: the right host -- http://www.debatepolitics.com/health...ight-host.html.

    The more we can do to prevent such a chance from happening, the better off billions of people are.

    And what we can do is all that we can to stop the disease from finding "new blood".

    With regard to the good doctor, here's my reply: http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...post1063903387.
    HIV can also mutate. What's different?
    Last edited by JasperL; 10-24-14 at 12:07 PM.

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    The issue is comparing other diseases to Ebola is apples and oranges. Address Ebola as an individual disease not "like" anything else because it isn't like anything else.
    It's relevant in the context I used the comparison. Right now Ebola just is not airborne. Yes, like any other (or many other) viruses, such as HIV, it CAN mutate and change the method of transmission. But for no other virus do we base medical or public policy on these theoretical possibilities. We deal with viruses based on how they DO transmit between humans, not how they theoretically might at some future date.

    Given all the information and misinformation I would choose to lower the risk and put proactive steps in place to protect the populace. By NOT taking proactive steps, you invite potential disaster, panic and death. I would take that risk for myself but not when I would be responsible and accountable for other people's lives.
    I suppose that's a decent point - the 'misinformation' is causing unjustified fears based on current medical science. But I don't see how validating fears based on misinformation by treating them as valid helps to assuage those fears.

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    The difference in the maps shows how the virus has spread. FWIW, the average daily figures for confirmed, probable, and suspected worldwide ebola cases for the last 3 weekly periods is below:

    7-Day Period Ending:
    October 5: 122 per day
    October 12: 138 per day
    October 19: 134 per day
    Keep in mind it's probably under reported as some families hide their sick.

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    It's relevant in the context I used the comparison. Right now Ebola just is not airborne.
    Neither is HIV, which you used as an example. It's not relevant since no other disease quite kills like Ebola. As Ebola is a virus it may change but it's unknown what effects those changes may take, how much time or if it would happen at all. It's not relevant in context... Ebola is unique in that sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Yes, like any other (or many other) viruses, such as HIV, it CAN mutate and change the method of transmission. But for no other virus do we base medical or public policy on these theoretical possibilities. We deal with viruses based on how they DO transmit between humans, not how they theoretically might at some future date.
    Agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I suppose that's a decent point - the 'misinformation' is causing unjustified fears based on current medical science. But I don't see how validating fears based on misinformation by treating them as valid helps to assuage those fears.
    By politicians showing they can take this disease and it's potential transmission seriously, they COULD calm the fears. Let's also not kid ourselves, we don't know what we don't know at this point. Siding with caution seems a win all around as it can lessen the transmission. I'd certainly want to plan to be ahead of a storm than risk being in one. The issue is our country's politics and politicians are not very good at risk management.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    For those who are interested, below are the World Health Organization's recommendations for dealing with the current Ebola outbreak:

    Recommendations for States with intense Ebola transmission (Guinea, Liberia, Sierra Leone)

    Exit screening in Guinea, Liberia and Sierra Leone remains critical for reducing the exportation of Ebola cases. States should maintain and reinforce high-quality exit screening of all persons at international airports, seaport, and major land crossings, for unexplained febrile illness consistent with potential Ebola infection. The exit screening should consist of, at a minimum, a questionnaire, a temperature measurement and, if fever is discovered, an assessment of the risk that the fever is caused by Ebola virus disease (EVD). States should collect data from their exit screening processes, monitor their results, and share these with WHO on a regular basis and in a timely fashion. This will increase public confidence and provide important information to other States.

    WHO and partners should provide additional support needed by States to further strengthen exit screening processes in a sustainable way.

    Recommendations for all States

    The Committee reiterated its recommendation that there should be no general ban on international travel or trade. A general travel ban is likely to cause economic hardship, and could consequently increase the uncontrolled migration of people from affected countries, raising the risk of international spread of Ebola. The Committee emphasized the importance of normalizing air travel and the movement of ships, including the handling of cargo and goods, to and from the affected areas, to reduce the isolation and economic hardship of the affected countries. Any necessary medical treatment should be available ashore for seafarers and passengers.

    Previous recommendations regarding the travel of EVD cases and contacts should continue to be implemented.

    A number of States have recently introduced entry screening measures. WHO encourages countries implementing such measures to share their experiences and lessons learned. Entry screening may have a limited effect in reducing international spread when added to exit screening, and its advantages and disadvantages should be carefully considered.

    If entry screening is implemented, States should take into account the following considerations: it offers an opportunity for individual sensitization, but the resource demands may be significant, even if screening is targeted; and management systems must be in place to care for travellers and suspected cases in compliance with International Health Regulations (IHR) requirements.

    A number of States without Ebola transmission have decided to or are considering cancelling international meetings and mass gatherings. Although the Committee does not recommend such cancellations, it recognizes that these are complex decisions that must be decided on a case-by-case basis. The Committee encourages States to use a risk-based approach to make these decisions. WHO has issued advice for countries hosting international meetings or mass gatherings, and will continue to provide guidance and support on this issue. The Committee agreed that there should not be a general ban on participation of competitors or delegations from countries with transmission of Ebola wishing to attend international events and mass gatherings but that the decision of participation must be made on a case by case basis by the hosting country. The temporary recommendations relating to travel should apply; additional health monitoring may be requested.

    All countries should strengthen education and communication efforts to combat stigma, disproportionate fear, and inappropriate measures and reactions associated with Ebola. Such efforts may also encourage self-reporting and early presentation for diagnosis and care.

    The Committee emphasized the importance of continued support by WHO and other national and international partners towards the effective implementation and monitoring of these recommendations.


    WHO | Statement on the 3rd meeting of the IHR Emergency Committee regarding the 2014 Ebola outbreak in West Africa

    Note: I underlined a portion of the recommendations, as that section rebuts a popular argument that has been raised in some sectors of the media with respect to limiting the spread of Ebola. I understand that at least some who have called for such restrictions are doing so in good faith and out of legitimate desire to curb the possible spread of Ebola. Nevertheless, at this time, I defer to the WHO's recommendation and its explanation for it.

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    The more Ebola and ISIS are in the news, the worse it is for Democrats and the worse it is for Obama's policies which are on the ballots this mid-term.
    Another one that makes it political.
    Last edited by EnigmaO01; 10-24-14 at 12:30 PM.

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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by EnigmaO01 View Post
    Another on that makes it political.
    Reality is a bitch ain't it? Whether you like it or not, it is already political, regardless of what I post or think.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Doctor being tested for Ebola in NYC

    Quote Originally Posted by EnigmaO01 View Post
    Keep in mind it's probably under reported as some families hide their sick.
    I don't disagree about a degree of under reporting. That's why it makes sense to use the figure that includes suspected cases so as to accommodate for that uncertainty to a degree. Hopefully, the level of uncertainty due to under reporting is relatively stable, allowing the reported figures to provide good insight into whether or not the spread of Ebola is accelerating or decelerating.

    For now, the development of new cases appears relatively stable on a weekly basis, but it's premature to have much confidence in the direction things will go in coming weeks. However, the longer the figures remain relatively stable, the less likely the nightmare scenario of approximately 10,000 new cases per week by year's end will become. Hopefully, in coming weeks, the number of new cases will decline and the outbreak will begin to diminish.

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