Page 9 of 11 FirstFirst ... 7891011 LastLast
Results 81 to 90 of 106

Thread: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

  1. #81
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Oh look. You won't even bother to try to answer my question.

    Since when was I ever anti-capitalist? It's embarrassing just how weak you are as a debater. It's even worse when I point out how you can't argue and then you go ahead and prove me right.



    Look kid, I already pointed out how we don't have direct flights and how other areas in the world are hubs. You simply do not understand the topic. I already pointed out how how such a ban on entry to those people is pointless because they are flying in through high density hubs. I pointed out the obvious point that preventing entry to a 6 day infected West African but letting in a 3 day infected French men is stupid. But that's what would happen under your asinine model. Block those from West Africa directly (somehow, which you cannot actually detail) but let everyone else they've come in contact with? How intelligent is that?

    You simply have no understanding of this topic at all.
    As already stated, the solution need not be perfect, merely better than what we have. Hope thats not too hard for you to comprehend. This isn't about guarantees-there are no guarantees in medicine.

  2. #82
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    and as i said, it won't completely solve the problem. there's still no good reason to have non-quarantined passengers from a nation where Ebola is endemic traveling on commercial airlines while the disease is spreading. sick patients can be brought in under controlled conditions on military flights for treatment, and the rest can be quarantined before getting on a plane going anywhere.
    That's true, but we don't have the capacity to force the global airline industry to simply bar all flights from West Africa to everywhere else. Furthermore, how does this stop people from traveling to other parts of Africa to get on a flight? You see where I'm going here right? The whole notion of travel embargos works back in the day when travel was slow. It doesn't work in a world of massive transit hubs and the ability to get almost anywhere in the world within 24 hours.

    we don't let anyone from an infected region who hasn't completed a 21 day quarantine into the country on a commercial airline. if the airlines won't play ball and choose to let non-quarantined passengers fly, they pay for the passengers to be quarantined for 21 days upon landing. the problem will solve itself quite quickly under a policy like that.
    How are we going to get the global airlines to do this from West Africa to the various hubs globally? Most of the airliners serving West Africa aren't US based. Most of them are African regionals to which we have zero control over. And given that so many people from West Africa have flown into hubs globally, it's already too late.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  3. #83
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    As already stated, the solution need not be perfect, merely better than what we have.
    How does action that will only placate ignorant people and give politicians something to say do anything useful?

    You can't even explain why my argument is allegedly wrong.

    Hope thats not too hard for you to comprehend. This isn't about guarantees-there are no guarantees in medicine.
    I'm embarrassed at your complete lack of any debate skills whatsoever. You can attempt to insult me, but we've demonstrated who actually understands this and it's not you.

    You're working under the completely asinine argument that there are lots of direct flights from West Africa to the US. Can you even name a single regional hub?
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  4. #84
    Global Moderator
    Moderator
    Helix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:28 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    37,136

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    That's true, but we don't have the capacity to force the global airline industry to simply bar all flights from West Africa to everywhere else. Furthermore, how does this stop people from traveling to other parts of Africa to get on a flight? You see where I'm going here right? The whole notion of travel embargos works back in the day when travel was slow. It doesn't work in a world of massive transit hubs and the ability to get almost anywhere in the world within 24 hours.
    we can see where ever passenger is coming from, and we can require a 21 day incubation period before they enter the country.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    How are we going to get the global airlines to do this from West Africa to the various hubs globally? Most of the airliners serving West Africa aren't US based. Most of them are African regionals to which we have zero control over. And given that so many people from West Africa have flown into hubs globally, it's already too late.
    as i said above, we know the travel histories of everyone on an incoming flight. we tell the airlines that no one is allowed in from that region without a 21 day incubation period. if they bring them here anyway, the passenger spends 21 days quarantined at the airline's expense.

  5. #85
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    How does action that will only placate ignorant people and give politicians something to say do anything useful?

    You can't even explain why my argument is allegedly wrong.



    I'm embarrassed at your complete lack of any debate skills whatsoever. You can attempt to insult me, but we've demonstrated who actually understands this and it's not you.

    You're working under the completely asinine argument that there are lots of direct flights from West Africa to the US. Can you even name a single regional hub?
    The number of flights from west africa is immaterial, rather its the number of people from west africa who are able to come here during an outbreak of a viral hemorrhagic disease with an up to 90% mortality. Huff and puff away.

  6. #86
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    we can see where ever passenger is coming from, and we can require a 21 day incubation period before they enter the country.
    So we're going to require all international passengers to undergo a 21 day incubation period in isolation? West Africans routinely fly into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. If we are truly honest with ourselves, we have to force a 21 day isolation period for everyone going through those hubs. Disease doesn't care where you came from.

    as i said above, we know the travel histories of everyone on an incoming flight. we tell the airlines that no one is allowed in from that region without a 21 day incubation period. if they bring them here anyway, the passenger spends 21 days quarantined at the airline's expense.
    But that does nothing to address the actual problem of West Africans flying into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. I don't see any point in blocking West Africans and letting everyone else they came in contact with in. I keep making the point about the West African and Frenchman for a reason.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  7. #87
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    The number of flights from west africa is immaterial, rather its the number of people from west africa who are able to come here during an outbreak of a viral hemorrhagic disease with an up to 90% mortality. Huff and puff away.
    Tell me how blocking West Africans who are flying in from Bangkok, Dubai or Paris is somehow going to prevent the spread of disease after they've exposed millions of people in those hubs to Ebola who are then free to travel to the US.

    Please, or you could do what I expect you to do: Refuse to actually make an argument and subtly engage in personal attacks.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  8. #88
    Global Moderator
    Moderator
    Helix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:28 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    37,136

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    So we're going to require all international passengers to undergo a 21 day incubation period in isolation? West Africans routinely fly into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. If we are truly honest with ourselves, we have to force a 21 day isolation period for everyone going through those hubs. Disease doesn't care where you came from.
    yes. as i said before, we know the travel history of everyone who comes into the country. if they haven't had a 21 day incubation period, then they go through one here at the airline's expense.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    But that does nothing to address the actual problem of West Africans flying into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. I don't see any point in blocking West Africans and letting everyone else they came in contact with in. I keep making the point about the West African and Frenchman for a reason.
    just because a solution isn't perfect doesn't mean that we should do nothing.

  9. #89
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    yes. as i said before, we know the travel history of everyone who comes into the country. if they haven't had a 21 day incubation period, then they go through one here at the airline's expense.
    But how do you even do a 21 day period outside of isolation before they fly? Are they suppose to fly into hub, get into an isolation chamber for 21 days and then fly out? How are you suppose to measure and enforce this? This whole thing isn't even doable. What's the point in an 21 day period if they're flying out from West Africa as it is? Say someone somehow manages to stay isolated for 21 days, on the bus to the airport, they encounter someone infected coughing up blood. What now? They've got the 21 days but now they're infected. This doesn't work.

    just because a solution isn't perfect doesn't mean that we should do nothing.
    But there are so many holes that render this pointless that the only thing it will do is placate ignorant people and give politicians something to say. The disruption alone in Europe will cost millions to billions and the impact upon our own health will be immaterial if that. As far as I'm concerned, Europe, Asia and the Middle East are already infected. Too many people have flown from West Africa to hubs and exposed millions of people. The only way a travel embargo will work is if we stop all international flights.

    A large number of medical and travel experts are against this and have simply accepted that Ebola is going to travel around the world regardless of what we do in terms of transit restrictions.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  10. #90
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Between Athens and Jerusalem
    Last Seen
    05-18-16 @ 07:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    33,522

    Re: Africa stems ebola via border closings, luck

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    So we're going to require all international passengers to undergo a 21 day incubation period in isolation? West Africans routinely fly into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. If we are truly honest with ourselves, we have to force a 21 day isolation period for everyone going through those hubs. Disease doesn't care where you came from.



    But that does nothing to address the actual problem of West Africans flying into European, Asian and Middle Eastern hubs. I don't see any point in blocking West Africans and letting everyone else they came in contact with in. I keep making the point about the West African and Frenchman for a reason.
    There exists a little book called a passport (socialists would like to see that done away with-workers unite!) and in that book we can see where people are from, and where they have been. If its an outbreak nation, they dont get to come to the US.

    This is quite basic, guy.

Page 9 of 11 FirstFirst ... 7891011 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •