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Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

Conservative said:
We have civil unions for people who want a legal relationship. No, what you want to do is destroy states' rights and centuries of history and precedence all for your own personal pleasure or in your case the pleasure for someone else.
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No, we don't. Please show me a civil union in any state that currently has same sex marriage bans, then show me how those are recognized by other states and/or the federal government.

Since I know you can't do this, that means that there is no equal protection.

And yes, I am all for destroying states' rights for individual rights when the state is full of bullies.
 
Conservative said:
My side? My company headquartered in Houston allows civil unions as well as benefits for same sex partners and this is a Houston based company so not sure exactly what you are talking about. I dealt with competitors as well who did the same thing.

I was married for over 40 years and marriage has been on the books for centuries. Don't you find it a bit disturbing that all this SSM lawsuit bs just surfaced in the 70's? Why is that? What makes this an issue now and one that by all estimates involves less than 5% of the American population? I contend it has nothing to do with pursuit of happiness but rather malcontents who are looking for and seeing attention. I have no use for these people nor for their cause especially if it isn't passed by the state electorate
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Your company is not the government. The government gives over a thousand benefits, privileges, rights, etc. to legally married spouses, not those in civil unions.

Before that, same sex couples were being persecuted by society and the government because it was believed that they had a mental disorder. It's called ignorance. Education is the cure.
 
Conservative said:
I could give a **** what you think of me or my opinions. I don't like the way you are going about getting what you want for your own pleasure but more importantly for attention. You want gay marriage approved,, get the population to approve it not the courts. You know the outcome of your efforts and that is why people like you don't want a Constitutional Amendment put to the people. The outcome won't be what you want.

What doesn't make sense to me is the passion you have and the excuse you make about this being about pursuit of happiness. This is nothing but personal arrogance and a malcontent looking for attention. find it someplace else. The people of your state should decide the issue and that should be the case in every state.
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Your side tried a constitutional Amendment on this issue twice, and failed, twice. 2004 and 2006, while George W. was in office. Now, you don't have the support.

No Constitutional Amendment is getting passed on this issue because it isn't needed. Same sex marriage is already covered under the Constitution.
 
Conservative said:
That is indeed the liberal argument yet you cannot point to the gay gene. I am still waiting. Homosexuality is a personal choice but it is easier for people like you to believe it is inherited or a born trait That is Bull****.
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Point to the left handed gene. Point to the gene that makes people tall or short. Point out the gene that makes people fat or thin. Point to the gene that controls our attraction to people based on their race, I dare you.
 
Conservative said:
I couldn't care less what some gay person has to say on the issue. I prefer science, show me the gay gene? Some people will do or say anything to justify their own behavior.
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This has to be the most contradictory comment I have ever seen from you. In one sentence you contradicted yourself. "I prefer science, show me the gay gene?" That shows that you don't even know what science says about genes in connection to personality at all. I doubt you would accept it even if there was a "gay gene" found, since you have proven that you don't know how this even works.
 
Conservative said:
Great, let's get a Constitutional Amendment like with Religion and gender. I will support your efforts and then lobby my Congressional Representative to keep marriage between a man and a woman.
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Please show me the Constitutional Amendment that protects gender.
 
Conservative said:
The fact that it isn't in the Constitution and that makes it a state issue. Civics isn't a strong suit of yours but arrogance is. Anyone that doesn't agree with you is a bigot? fortunately you constitution less than 5% of the population so I couldn't care less what you think.
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SCOTUS has outright rejected your idea that the 14th only applies to constitutionally-enumerated rights.
 
Conservative said:
That is indeed the liberal argument yet you cannot point to the gay gene. I am still waiting. Homosexuality is a personal choice but it is easier for people like you to believe it is inherited or a born trait That is Bull****.
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That's because genes aren't singular on/off switches. You are waiting on something based on your really, really poor understanding of genetics. Being gay isn't just a matter of one gene switching on or off. Don't demand other people conform to your scientific illiteracy.
 
Conservative said:
Great, let's get a Constitutional Amendment like with Religion and gender. I will support your efforts and then lobby my Congressional Representative to keep marriage between a man and a woman.
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Gender is already protected and that covers same-sex marriage.
 
year2late said:
So you think mot gay people are just lying about being "born gay"?:shock:
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Yes, sure do although I don't believe they even realize they are lying. There is no such thing as a gay gene and telling people they were born gay is the easy way out for them
 
Conservative said:
My side? My company headquartered in Houston allows civil unions as well as benefits for same sex partners and this is a Houston based company so not sure exactly what you are talking about. I dealt with competitors as well who did the same thing.

I was married for over 40 years and marriage has been on the books for centuries. Don't you find it a bit disturbing that all this SSM lawsuit bs just surfaced in the 70's? Why is that? What makes this an issue now and one that by all estimates involves less than 5% of the American population? I contend it has nothing to do with pursuit of happiness but rather malcontents who are looking for and seeing attention. I have no use for these people nor for their cause especially if it isn't passed by the state electorate
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You really aren't capable of seeing things from others' point of view i guess. Trust me we have no use for you either

There was no gay rights movement prior to 1970s to speak of because so few were even openly gay. Stonewall happened in 1969 and in san fran there were clashes with cops thru the 1970s. In other words, you couldn't even go to a gay bar without being assaulted by cops. It's just like any other civil rights movement. Progress happens (extremely) gradually while waiting for those opposed to die off, so here we are.
 
Conservative said:
Yes, sure do although I don't believe they even realize they are lying. There is no such thing as a gay gene and telling people they were born gay is the easy way out for them
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See, again, you know so little about genetics, and yet you continue to spout off information as if it is fact.
 
Conservative said:
I could give a **** what you think of me or my opinions. I don't like the way you are going about getting what you want for your own pleasure but more importantly for attention. You want gay marriage approved,, get the population to approve it not the courts. You know the outcome of your efforts and that is why people like you don't want a Constitutional Amendment put to the people. The outcome won't be what you want.

What doesn't make sense to me is the passion you have and the excuse you make about this being about pursuit of happiness. This is nothing but personal arrogance and a malcontent looking for attention. find it someplace else. The people of your state should decide the issue and that should be the case in every state.
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Oh, what a mind reader we have here! You can stop putting words in my mouth anytime, cause i've said nothing about pursuit of happiness or attention. Especially on some anonymous forum, attention whoring is quite an absurd accusation.

It's about equality only. Similar to employment discrimination, some take the stance we should not have such laws period, but that so long as we do, sexuality needs to be covered as well. You know, because that's equality. Although i disagree in that i think we do need anti discrimination laws, at least they take a rational, consistent approach. This "everyone can get married or protected from discrimination *except* those homos" is simply coming from hatred. At least admit to that
 
Conservative said:
Yes, sure do although I don't believe they even realize they are lying. There is no such thing as a gay gene and telling people they were born gay is the easy way out for them
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lol how can we make a 'choice' and not even realize it? Quite the conundrum
 
Peter King said:
Your society? How about everyone's society? Your wedding behavior impacts the state taxes of the unmarried, elderly and the gays? Your marrying impacts their court system. You consider it gay friendly enough if gays are not being thrown in jail? Yeah, that says everything about the great republican view on freedom, the pursuit of happiness and all the things mentioned in the US constitution and the bill of rights. Religious freedom and gun rights are paramount. Democracy, civility, all other rights that do not benefit the religious right are of no interest to the conservatives.
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Papa bull said:
State endorsement of marriage at the state level is very much about taxes. Homosexual marriage will lower state and federal revenues. Basically, it's a tax dodge for homosexuals.
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So you got married just so you could dodge taxes? Really?
 
Papa bull said:
We the people don't want our state to endorse homosexual marriage. I imagine it's a matter of time before the deviant left wins this but for now, the will of the people still prevails in my state. Thanks for asking.
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What state are you in? Irrational hysteria?
 
Conservative said:
Yes, sure do although I don't believe they even realize they are lying. There is no such thing as a gay gene and telling people they were born gay is the easy way out for them
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They do not realize they are lying? :shock:
 
christ sakes, does any other self identified conservative wish to speak up and disavow this embarrassment, or do you all wish to let "conservative" speak for you?

I'm tired of the lukewarm pseudo acceptance from conservatives, made all the more transparent when they can't tell one of their own to stop being so hateful.
 
chromium said:
You really aren't capable of seeing things from others' point of view i guess. Trust me we have no use for you either

There was no gay rights movement prior to 1970s to speak of because so few were even openly gay. Stonewall happened in 1969 and in san fran there were clashes with cops thru the 1970s. In other words, you couldn't even go to a gay bar without being assaulted by cops. It's just like any other civil rights movement. Progress happens (extremely) gradually while waiting for those opposed to die off, so here we are.
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I grew up in San Francisco in the 60's and 70's.

I find it ironic that the bigoted talk back then was that gay people were freaks that only wanted anonymous sex and had no ability to understand monogamy.
 
chromium said:
christ sakes, does any other self identified conservative wish to speak up and disavow this embarrassment, or do you all wish to let "conservative" speak for you?

I'm tired of the lukewarm pseudo acceptance from conservatives, made all the more transparent when they can't tell one of their own to stop being so hateful.
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Wouldn't that be nice.
 
JasperL said:
By "nothing more than opinions" you mean conclusions based on mountains of evidence I guess. If so, then yes, I tend to try to hold views consistent with mountains of evidence, especially when contradictory evidence is virtually non-existent.

The only reason this issue even matters to me is the experience of one of my brother's best friends whose family believed their son "chose" to be gay, and so it's OK if they disown him, shun him, write him out of their lives, because if he loved his family, he'd simply change that decision to be gay and choose to be straight and not bring shame to the family. It gave them the excuse to shift the blame and the consequences to him. It's a sad situation, rooted in ignorance.

FWIW, no one really knows the cause. Could be a gene, could be something happened in the womb, early experiences, or a combination. That part doesn't matter. What does matter is there is simply no evidence that more than a tiny sliver of the most highly motivated individuals successfully change sexual orientation.
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Even a study done a couple of years ago by Christian researchers showed that sexual orientation doesn't change even for those highly motivated by their religious beliefs:


“Characteristics of Mixed Orientation Couples: An Empirical Study":

"While it was not a study of efforts to change, one could reasonably assume that if a group had participants who had shifted orientation very much, then this would be the group. However, that is not what they found"

Christian Psychologist Dr Throckmorton says: "I think evangelicals need to face what evangelical academics are finding in research"




 
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Conservative said:
That is indeed the liberal argument yet you cannot point to the gay gene. I am still waiting. Homosexuality is a personal choice but it is easier for people like you to believe it is inherited or a born trait That is Bull****.
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Conservative said:
I couldn't care less what some gay person has to say on the issue. I prefer science, show me the gay gene? Some people will do or say anything to justify their own behavior.
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Christian psychologist Dr Warren Throckmorton is a well known, respected (and honest) clinician and researcher who works in this field.

He explains why many evangelical Christians seem to know so little about the research about sexual orientation. They only read "evangelical publications and consume evangelical media."

The Evangelical Blackout of Research on Sexual Orientation — Warren Throckmorton

There is plenty of reliable information about sexual orientation and gay people freely available from reputable health organisations. Even more if a person has access to peer-reviewed reputable science Journals.
 
Conservative said:
Yes, sure do although I don't believe they even realize they are lying. There is no such thing as a gay gene and telling people they were born gay is the easy way out for them
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I don't believe you even realise just how uninformed you are about this topic. It's the easy way out for you not bother to educate yourself.
 
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chromium said:
You really aren't capable of seeing things from others' point of view i guess. Trust me we have no use for you either

There was no gay rights movement prior to 1970s to speak of because so few were even openly gay. Stonewall happened in 1969 and in san fran there were clashes with cops thru the 1970s. In other words, you couldn't even go to a gay bar without being assaulted by cops. It's just like any other civil rights movement. Progress happens (extremely) gradually while waiting for those opposed to die off, so here we are.
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Great, enjoy the rest of your life
 
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