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Thread: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

  1. #221
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Note that the states aren't banning homosexual liaisons. A state's ban on gay marriage is a statement that it is not going to be coerced into normalizing homosexuality and sanctioning homosexual unions and giving tax incentives for people to enter into homosexual unions. The "benefit" is that they don't have to jump through whatever hoops homosexuals want. Unless a state sees a benefit in doing so, it shouldn't be made to do so and this state sees no benefit in sanctioning homosexual unions as "marriage" and I think my state's decision is a wise one.
    Even if all this nonsense were true, what is the state's interest in preventing homosexuality from being normalized or in not providing incentives for gays to marry? Other than your own personal distaste or the distaste of some religious groups which does not constitute a legitimate state interest, of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You are not incorrect. However, the equal protection clause is an exception because its purpose was to limit state powers. The real question is then not whether their is a Constitutional right to same-sex marriage but whether or not states have the Constitutional authority to ban same-sex marriage. That is where your side has failed to provide a sufficient argument as to the rationality of these bans. But if you do not even recognize the legitimacy of the courts to interpret the Constitution then there really is no debate to be had. You reject the very notion of how the government has been run for over 200 years.
    I have never understood how a person can read that the judiciary's power extends to all cases arising under the constitution but claim that a petitioner cannot contend that an act by congress violates the constitution. Or rather, that no court can grant that particular relief to a petitioner. Ultimately, that argument contends that the only check at all on congress is the presidential veto. Otherwise, there is no actual way of making congress adhere to the constitution. Otherwise they are free to violate it at all. And it's the small government conservatives who make this argument. It's very confusing.
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Let's see how marriage has made out in the Netherlands since 2001. Marriage is at the lowest level as a percentage of the population since 1935. Only 1 in 10 homosexuals is married today and marriage as a social institution is in steady decline. The Netherlands blows away any argument that homosexual marriage is actually a good thing for the institution of marriage in our society. It either coincides with the dismal decline of marriage in the Netherlands or is at least partly to blame for it.

    Conclusion from this evaluation: http://www.marriagedebate.com/pdf/iMAPP.May2011-rev.pdf is below.
    No, marriage is not in decline. You talk the talk but you do not know the facts.

    Marriage before 2001 was the only option to get the benefits that married couples get in the Netherlands. Around 2001 gays and straight were given the option of either marrying or opting for a registered partnership for people who never were really into the whole marriage thing but did want legal protection in case of death, taxes, etc. etc. etc.

    So the number of marriage may have gone down from about 82 thousand a year to about 72 thousand (up to 2012) but where before 2001 there were zero registered partnerships, now there are about 10,000 every year. Making the entire number of registered relationships is still about 82 thousand.

    And also, there is also the fact that people no longer feel the need to get a marriage license anymore. If a child is born in the Netherlands it is no longer necessary for the parents to be married but still get the name of the father. Even my grandmother choose to shack up with a guy without getting married after my grandfather died. It is not gay weddings that have made there be less marriages, it is the passing of time and the emancipation of women.

    Sorry, but your comments just make no sense.
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    They are not barred from marriage. The fact that marriage law requires the union of one of EACH sex - the pairing of opposites that is actually MARRIAGE does not bar them from being married. There is no law stating that you must assert that you are heterosexual before being married. The pairing of opposite sexes is the very purpose of marriage. The homogenous union of two people of the same sex is something but it's not a marriage. At least it wasn't until the Canada and the Netherlands decided to volunteer to be guinea pigs in this social experiment. I think it's too bad we aren't waiting longer to see what happens to them before deciding to join them. I think it's foolish on our part.
    In other words, they are being barred from marrying the one they love. Simple and it proves that they cannot marry the one they love, the only way the can marry is if they lie and live a fake life. Sorry but that is not being allowed to marry, that is raping your own personality just so that you can have a dishonest marriage with a woman.

    And it is not a social experiment, it is respecting actual civil rights of all citizens in your country to engage in behavior that is legal for all other people in that country.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    However, it was his assertion, shared by others, that the majority already approves.
    They do, on average. Even Texas polls a plurality in favor. (Albeit within the margin of error, and just a plurality rather than majority)

    however, due to the realities of gerrymandered districts, party majorities, ballot measure processes and constitutional amendments, the hurdles for repealing the marriage ban are higher than merely taking a poll. It varies by state, of course, but state constitutional amendments aren't so easily removed. In the end, 52% support isn't going to get marriage equality in Alabama. Because we aren't a direct democracy. Alabama had a majority (R) legislature, and they sure as hell aren't going to enact marriage equality just because a poll says slightly over 50% support itm

    but, again, there is absolutely no reason for the minority to wait on the approval of the majority, nor the slow crawl of legislative actions.
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    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    In other words, they are being barred from marrying the one they love. Simple and it proves that they cannot marry the one they love, the only way the can marry is if they lie and live a fake life. Sorry but that is not being allowed to marry, that is raping your own personality just so that you can have a dishonest marriage with a woman.

    And it is not a social experiment, it is respecting actual civil rights of all citizens in your country to engage in behavior that is legal for all other people in that country.
    If you don't want to flyfish, don't insist on fishing a flyfishing only stream and don't whine that you are being persecuted because you prefer spinning tackle.

    Marriage is a heterosexual thing and always was despite specious arguments by homosexuals and advocates of homosexuality. Two people of the same sex living together may be a relationship of one sort or another but it isn't a marriage.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Incorrect. The laws apply equally to you whether you are heterosexual or not. A heterosexual can't marry someone of the same sex, either. This isn't an equal rights issue.
    Heterosexual people have no desire to marry people that are the same sex, they're straight! you know this. An adult should be able to marry another adult regardless of their gender. We get it, you don't personally like it. I don't like when men wear open toed sandals and flip flops, however it doesn't personally affect me and I have zero right to tell a guy He can't wear hippie sandals. Forget about it and walk on dude.
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryChinaski View Post
    Heterosexual people have no desire to marry people that are the same sex, they're straight! you know this. An adult should be able to marry another adult regardless of their gender.
    Well, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but it's a very queer opinion (some pun intended) and it's one that's only recently been considered to be a wonderful brainstorm by liberals.

    We get it, you don't personally like it.
    You enjoy using the royal "we", I see.

    I don't like when men wear open toed sandals and flip flops, however it doesn't personally affect me and I have zero right to tell a guy He can't wear hippie sandals. Forget about it and walk on dude.
    Marriage is a sanction the government must issue. You know... the government of the people and by the people. And if "we the people" don't approve, we shouldn't be forced to sanction it. You can live with who you want but you can't force society to sanction it. Not rightly. It looks like you may end up forcing that, anyway, but it's not a pushover and it's a long hard road because you SHOULDN'T be able to force that. This is why it will be bad if the court forces homosexual marriage on states that don't want it. It's something that should be done through the legislative process IF the states want it because it IS their business becuase it's THEIR sanction people are trying to attain.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  8. #228
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    1.)If you don't want to flyfish, don't insist on fishing a flyfishing only stream and don't whine that you are being persecuted because you prefer spinning tackle.
    2.)Marriage is a heterosexual thing and always was despite specious arguments by homosexuals and advocates of homosexuality.
    3.) Two people of the same sex living together may be a relationship of one sort or another but it isn't a marriage.
    1.) good thing that has nothing to do with equal rights and isnt a parallel analogy to SSM in anyway lol
    2.) another posted lie that has been proven false many times by facts links and many posters, also meanignless to equal rights
    3,) another posted lie, facts also prove this wrong, in some states it is indeed a legal marriage, your feelings dont change this fact

    Facts win again
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    1.)Well, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but it's a very queer opinion (some pun intended) and it's one that's only recently been considered to be a wonderful brainstorm by liberals.
    2.)You enjoy using the royal "we", I see.
    3.)Marriage is a sanction the government must issue.
    4.)You know... the government of the people and by the people.
    5.) And if "we the people" don't approve, we shouldn't be forced to sanction it.
    6.) You can live with who you want but you can't force society to sanction it. Not rightly.
    7.) It looks like you may end up forcing that, anyway, but it's not a pushover and it's a long hard road because you SHOULDN'T be able to force that.
    8.) This is why it will be bad if the court forces homosexual marriage on states that don't want it.
    9.) It's something that should be done through the legislative process IF the states want it because it IS their business becuase it's THEIR sanction people are trying to attain.
    1.) no its called equal rights as court cases prove
    2.) correct cause its accurate. We get you are against equal rights
    3.) its a contract that people enter into
    4.) correct, you know the people that equal rights apply too, all of them
    5.) there is no FORCE, and we the people dont get to take away the rights of others LMAO see woman's rights, minority rights and interracial marriage and now SSM all things that prove your statments factually wrong.
    6.) once again there is ZERO force lol
    7.) see #6 that posted lie already failed
    8.) good thing the courts havent even done that once so theres no concern about it
    9.) once again facts laws, rights and court cases all prpve this wrong

    too funny simply repeating those lies wont change the the facts, law, rights and court cases

    maybe a solid, logical, sound argument that can be support with facts should be tried . . . . .just a idea

    also I notice you are still dodging my questions . . VERY telling
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    Re: Alaska ban on same-sex marriage ruled unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Well, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but it's a very queer opinion (some pun intended) and it's one that's only recently been considered to be a wonderful brainstorm by liberals.



    You enjoy using the royal "we", I see.



    Marriage is a sanction the government must issue. You know... the government of the people and by the people. And if "we the people" don't approve, we shouldn't be forced to sanction it. You can live with who you want but you can't force society to sanction it. Not rightly. It looks like you may end up forcing that, anyway, but it's not a pushover and it's a long hard road because you SHOULDN'T be able to force that. This is why it will be bad if the court forces homosexual marriage on states that don't want it. It's something that should be done through the legislative process IF the states want it because it IS their business becuase it's THEIR sanction people are trying to attain.
    Right, just as slavery was and separate lunch counters, times change, the status quo changes, positive societies move forward.
    Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can sit in a boat, drinking beer all day while you fool around with his Woman.

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