Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 81

Thread: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

  1. #71
    Sage
    Excon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Last Seen
    10-14-17 @ 01:26 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,997

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    "An average hourly rate for clerical staff to make copies. The FY 2010 average hourly pay rate for clerical staff is $12. This will be the standard fee for staff time for making copies, with a minimum charge of $6 or ½ hour of time." Open Record-Sunshine Requests - DNR
    Are you not paying attention. "An outside consulting firm is being used, which is reasonable."

    Nor is this the ****ing Department of Natural Resources we are talking about.

    And your insinuation that they are hiding something is just as absurd.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

  2. #72
    Gradualist

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    09-25-17 @ 12:48 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    34,949
    Blog Entries
    6

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Are you not paying attention. "An outside consulting firm is being used, which is reasonable."

    Ohhh Excon... It was one case they wanted to pay an outside firm, and they didnt call it "reasonable"...
    "Ferguson told the AP it wanted nearly $2,000 to pay a consulting firm for up to 16 hours of work to retrieve messages on its own email system, a practice that information technology experts call unnecessary. "
    Nor is this the ****ing Department of Natural Resources we are talking about.
    This is standard fees.
    And your insinuation that they are hiding something is just as absurd.
    Really? Why all the red tape? Why the extra costs?


  3. #73
    Sage
    Excon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Last Seen
    10-14-17 @ 01:26 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,997

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Ohhh Excon... It was one case they wanted to pay an outside firm, and they didnt call it "reasonable"...
    One case.
    And yes it is reasonable given it is an outside firm being contracted to do the work.
    Whether the requester thinks it is reasonable or not matters not one iota. Duh!
    It is still reasonable when an outside firm is contracted.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    This is standard fees.

    For the DNR which we are not discussing.
    For the DNR who is not inundated with requests.
    For the DNR who is not contracting with an outside firm.
    Stop with the absurdities.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Really? Why all the red tape? Why the extra costs?
    Holy ****! Try using some common sense.

    Yes really. Duh!
    The information can be obtained if the price is paid. That is not hiding a damn thing.
    Had it been priced outside of anyone's reach, then you might have had a point. But since it isn't, your insinuation is illogical and absurd.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

  4. #74
    Gradualist

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    09-25-17 @ 12:48 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    34,949
    Blog Entries
    6

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    One case.
    Thats literally what the article states. It reads on a case to case basis.

    And yes it is reasonable given it is an outside firm being contracted to do the work.
    Again. "a practice that information technology experts call unnecessary. "

    Whether the requester thinks it is reasonable or not matters not one iota. Duh!
    It is still reasonable when an outside firm is contracted.
    Sooo what experts think is dumb!


    For the DNR which we are not discussing.
    For the DNR who is not inundated with requests.
    For the DNR who is not contracting with an outside firm.
    Stop with the absurdities.
    No. For everything that is accounted with the Sunshine Law.
    "The Sunshine Law applies to all records, regardless of what form they are kept in, and to all meetings, regardless of the manner in which they are held.

    When responding to a request for copies of its records, the Sunshine Law limits how much a public body can charge for copying and research costs."

    Missouri Sunshine law top ten things to know



    Section 610-026 Fees for copying public records, limita
    " Fees for copying public records, except those records restricted under section 32.091, shall not exceed ten cents per page for a paper copy not larger than nine by fourteen inches, with the hourly fee for duplicating time not to exceed the average hourly rate of pay for clerical staff of the public governmental body. Research time required for fulfilling records requests may be charged at the actual cost of research time.

    Fees for providing access to public records maintained on computer facilities, recording tapes or disks, videotapes or films, pictures, maps, slides, graphics, illustrations or similar audio or visual items or devices, and for paper copies larger than nine by fourteen inches shall include only the cost of copies, staff time, which shall not exceed the average hourly rate of pay for staff of the public governmental body "
    http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C600-699/6100000026.HTM



    Holy ****! Try using some common sense.

    Yes really. Duh!
    The information can be obtained if the price is paid. That is not hiding a damn thing.
    Had it been priced outside of anyone's reach, then you might have had a point. But since it isn't, your insinuation is illogical and absurd.


  5. #75
    Irremovable Intelligence
    Removable Mind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    23,805

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    The link below will give you an idea about the document retrieval business.

    If people think that the Ferguson case document fees are crazy. Try working at a Medical Malpractice Law Firm, which will pay into the tens of thousands for medical records and other types of information necessary to support their cases.

    USDRS Rates

  6. #76
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    60,111

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    The link below will give you an idea about the document retrieval business.

    If people think that the Ferguson case document fees are crazy. Try working at a Medical Malpractice Law Firm, which will pay into the tens of thousands for medical records and other types of information necessary to support their cases.

    USDRS Rates
    Those rates don't even come close to the $135/hr Ferguson is charging
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  7. #77
    Phonetic Mnemonic ©
    radcen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Look to your right... I'm that guy.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:21 AM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    33,785

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    The link below will give you an idea about the document retrieval business.

    If people think that the Ferguson case document fees are crazy. Try working at a Medical Malpractice Law Firm, which will pay into the tens of thousands for medical records and other types of information necessary to support their cases.

    USDRS Rates
    Those rates don't even come close to the $135/hr Ferguson is charging
    They're also not a public entity supported by tax dollars and working as a public service. Private vs public comparisons just aren't applicable here.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  8. #78
    Irremovable Intelligence
    Removable Mind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    23,805

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Those rates don't even come close to the $135/hr Ferguson is charging
    I hear ya, Sangha. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with the charges. I'm just pointing out that document retrieval can be expensive, especially when using a professional service. And the rates that I posted aren't necessarily typical. Some can be more. Some can be less. It all depends on the type of information sought.

    So Ferguson has resorted to legal ways to deter people from getting information that might be used against the city. We live in a nation that loves and supports governments that like to extort. What else is new?

  9. #79
    Sage
    Excon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Last Seen
    10-14-17 @ 01:26 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,997

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Thats literally what the article states. It reads on a case to case basis.
    Oh Gawd.
    They are still reasonable costs.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Again. "a practice that information technology experts call unnecessary. "


    Sooo what experts think is dumb!

    Biased article is biased. What they think is irrelevant. There was no reason to provided said information except to provided a biased spin.
    IT experts are not management experts, nor do they run the show in Ferguson. You know why? Because they are IT experts.
    What they think has no bearing on this because their knowledge only applies to one aspect (the gathering of) and not to the amount of people involved the department needs to employ to gather or the costs associated with it.
    So by default, their opinion is irrelevant as it is ignorant.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    No. For everything that is accounted with the Sunshine Law.
    "The Sunshine Law applies to all records, regardless of what form they are kept in, and to all meetings, regardless of the manner in which they are held.
    Ah yes!
    We are not discussing the DNR, and as such what they charge is irrelevant.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    When responding to a request for copies of its records, the Sunshine Law limits how much a public body can charge for copying and research costs."

    Missouri Sunshine law top ten things to know

    Section 610-026 Fees for copying public records, limita
    " Fees for copying public records, except those records restricted under section 32.091, shall not exceed ten cents per page for a paper copy not larger than nine by fourteen inches, with the hourly fee for duplicating time not to exceed the average hourly rate of pay for clerical staff of the public governmental body. Research time required for fulfilling records requests may be charged at the actual cost of research time.

    Fees for providing access to public records maintained on computer facilities, recording tapes or disks, videotapes or films, pictures, maps, slides, graphics, illustrations or similar audio or visual items or devices, and for paper copies larger than nine by fourteen inches shall include only the cost of copies, staff time, which shall not exceed the average hourly rate of pay for staff of the public governmental body "
    http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C600-699/6100000026.HTM


    You don't seem to understand what you are quoting.
    The enlarged clearly allows for differences in costs.
    And if they are employing an outside firm to do the research, as in one case, those additional costs would be reasonable.


    So back to your absurdly illogical statement of; "The city of Ferguson is obviously is hiding something... "
    You haven't shown any such thing.

    Common sense suggests that since the cost can be afforded and even paid to obtain said info, that the cost are not associated with any attempt to hide a damn thing.
    So you can laugh your head off with that icon, as you are only laughing at your lame attempt and failure to show they were hiding anything.




    Yes really. Duh!
    The information can be obtained if the price is paid. That is not hiding a damn thing.
    Had it been priced outside of anyone's reach, then you might have had a point. But since it isn't, your insinuation is illogical and absurd.
    Last edited by Excon; 09-30-14 at 01:52 PM.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

  10. #80
    Kinky
    tres borrachos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    New England
    Last Seen
    01-12-18 @ 07:14 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    40,467

    Re: Ferguson Demands High Fees To Turn Over City Files

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    e-mail accounts following the shooting, police reports, personnel files, text messages.
    And because they wanted to see what the city government and officials were doing following the shooting. Doing some reporting, ya know.



    No.
    No? There were more than a few questions there my friend!

Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •