Page 11 of 59 FirstFirst ... 91011121321 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 110 of 585

Thread: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

  1. #101
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-15-17 @ 10:49 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,323

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Americans don't want boots on the ground.

    A majority of Americans -- 60 percent -- told a poll conducted for CNN they don’t want ground troops to be part of the combat operation against ISIS while 38 percent said they favor ground troops and 2 percent had no opinion.

    US Ground Troops ISIS Poll: Americans Don't Want Boots On The Ground, Unless Military Does

    Of course we know that boots will eventually be on the ground, and we'll likely have another long conflict costly in blood and treasure, ending with a declaration of "decimation" and the only real beneficiaries will be the defense contractors big business.
    When the general public is trained in warfare, they can make smart decision about war. Just because they don't want "boots on the ground" doesn't mean it isn't the correct solution. The public is talking politics, not tactics.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  2. #102
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-15-17 @ 10:49 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,323

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    You're dismissing the will of the people in favor of boots on the ground. Perhaps that's how you'd like to see things work, but that's not the democratic way.
    We have a republican form of government, polls don't decide policy. What people should do is vote out representatives that don't listen to their constituents; if they don't like policy.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  3. #103
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,584

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    It was never intended to work, its a dog and pony show prior to the mid terms.
    Dog and pony shows can be very effective. And if that is all it is intended to be, then it IS working.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

  4. #104
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,584

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    When the general public is trained in warfare, they can make smart decision about war. Just because they don't want "boots on the ground" doesn't mean it isn't the correct solution. The public is talking politics, not tactics.
    I agree. I can't imagine why most of us think that we know more about warfare than the people who study and live it for a living.

    I've tried to put myself in the position of boots on the ground, fighting an enemy who we can't tell from the locals. About the only thing we could do is to stand around and wait until we are being shot at and then shoot back. Seems to me that would put US troops at a huge disadvantage over ISIS. It wouldn't be so hard for ISIS to determine who the American troops are.

    We would be fighting in a situation where EVERYONE is an enemy to some extent or another, and it would probably be a mistake to believe that they Syrian and Iraqi people (in general) don't see the US as being an enemy also.

    We've been that rout before, and it didn't work out well.

    I'm not saying that we don't need boots on the ground to win, but we would be better off if those boots were the people who had more skin in the game than we do - the Iraqi and Syrian people.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

  5. #105
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,584

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    We have a republican form of government, polls don't decide policy. What people should do is vote out representatives that don't listen to their constituents; if they don't like policy.
    thus, indirectly, polls do decide policy. While we have a republic, we also have a form of democracy - the two are not mutually exclusive.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

  6. #106
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-15-17 @ 10:49 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,323

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    thus, indirectly, polls do decide policy. While we have a republic, we also have a form of democracy - the two are not mutually exclusive.
    But when you try and use poll data to infer that govt policy should directly follow it, that is not republican....but mob rule.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  7. #107
    Global Moderator
    Moderator

    Zyphlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    NoMoAuchie
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    47,998

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    As a result, the various Al Queda groups- yes, I know that ISIS is not Al Queda, have quickly acknowledged and reported casualties.
    Do you have some source substantiate this? I'm not saying it's wrong, just saying I can't remember many instances of news where I've seen ISIS or Al Queda announcing their casualty numbers. Or, more specific to what I asked you, actively coming out and suggesting that American or allied force attacks have been effective.

    Likewise, Hamas and Hezbollah have been generally willing to acknowledge deaths from Israeli military actions and publically acknowledge casualties via paying out death benefits.
    Different situation there. Propoganda over the years has done well in painting Israel as a "evil", or at least "negative", entity in the eyes of many in the west and such acknowledgements have a tangible benefit to their side by creating a significant rise of opposition against israel's actions. It's unlikely that ISIS would engender a similar response at this time.

    You seem to have difficulty grasping the concept that one can, at the same time, be:
    A. A terrorist
    B for varying motivations, truthful
    Not at all. I'm simply suggesting that a terrorist has little reason to acknowledge publicly anything that would hurt their efforts. I don't expect a terrorist organization to come out and say "Your tactics are working well." That's asinine. I expect a terrorist organization, just like I generally would expect a country, to act in their best interest.

    Does it mean they're lying when they say it's not effective? No. Not at all. But I view it like a carney playing a shell game.

    The Carney may tell me that the ball isn't under a certain shell. He might be telling me the truth. He might not be telling me the truth. I don't know. What I can reasonably guess however is the Carney doesn't WANT me to win so he's not willingly giving me useful information without some kind of ulterior motive. As such, when choosing which shell I turn over the information the Carney told me would be very low on my list of reasons I pick said shell.

    Same thing with Poker. If a Poker player says he has a bad hand it's foolish to assume he's just being truthful. At the same time, it's foolish to assume he's completely lying, as it's quite possible he's trying to bluff you into folding by making you THINK that he's lying. What it boils down to is the Poker Player, since he is obvious attepmting to put himself in the best position, is a poor source to judge based on his volunatirly given information. it doesn't matter if he's telling the truth or not, there's no reason to think he's actively trying to help you so you should be looking for other tells and information to make your determination other than simply trusting that he's being 100% truthful.

    In the case of the terrorists, they may be telling the truth about it being ineffective. Or they could be lying. I don't honestly know. What I have a reasonable guess of however is that they're not going to come out and say anything that they believe would harm their efforts or help ours. So that makes their statement of little worth.

    Does it mean their statement is untrue? Not at all, it simlply means it's not a very trustworthy statement.

    I never said I took the word of ISIS unchallenged. Rather, I always took the totality of their claim and the other factors to draw a conclusion that they may well be telling the truth.
    Exactly. And I never said to COMPLETELY disregard ISIS's word. I suggested it would simply be at the bottom of a LONG list of other factors that would be my primary focus for drawing a conclussion.

  8. #108
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    the high desert
    Last Seen
    01-10-15 @ 11:20 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,337

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    He did not say "we start bombing in 10 days." He did not say where we'd be bombing. I'm not the one lying here.
    So here we are again. "Depends what the meaning of "is" is. Depends on what the meaning of "warning" is. Yes Kobie you are correct. Obama never said. I'm "warning" you guys I am going to start bombing you.

  9. #109
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,584

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    But when you try and use poll data to infer that govt policy should directly follow it, that is not republican....but mob rule.
    If a degree of democracy is the same thing as mob rule, then I'm all for mob rule. At least it's an organized mob following rules and proceedures. I find that preferable to any alternative.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

  10. #110
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,584

    Re: ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

    Quote Originally Posted by lifeisshort View Post
    So here we are again. "Depends what the meaning of "is" is. Depends on what the meaning of "warning" is. Yes Kobie you are correct. Obama never said. I'm "warning" you guys I am going to start bombing you.
    Can you think of a scenario when the enemy wouldn't suspect that we are going to start bombing them? Or when they wouldn't try to hide their command and control and fortify their positions?

    I guess maybe if we started bombing Canada today, they wouldn't suspect it.

    It was conservatives who started beating the drums of war first, not Obama. It's also possible, that if conservatives are right about the world thinking that Obama is so weak, that they didn't expect it. We dunno.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

Page 11 of 59 FirstFirst ... 91011121321 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •