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Thread: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

  1. #351
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    That is just not true. His statement said "we stayed away from him". It does not mention threatened or scared.

    http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/n..._-_Final_2.pdf
    Why would they stay away from him if they didn't feel either "threatened or scared"? Why did the mother react as she did, moving her children immediately out of the area upon seeing the guy with the gun, then gesturing as if trying to get someone's attention in the garden department, then, after entering back into the store itself, walking the completely opposite direction? She was threatened. I definitely recognized that reaction.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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  2. #352
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Why would they stay away from him if they didn't feel either "threatened or scared"? Why did the mother react as she did, moving her children immediately out of the area upon seeing the guy with the gun, then gesturing as if trying to get someone's attention in the garden department, then, after entering back into the store itself, walking the completely opposite direction? She was threatened. I definitely recognized that reaction.
    She didn't move immediately out of the area. She lingered there for 10 seconds and when she left, she left her daughter behind. She also did not gesture to anyone.

    If she felt threatened by a crazy man with a gun, then why did she walk back into the with her children?

    Is that something a parent who feels their children's lives are threatened does?
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  3. #353
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    No, they don't have to. They take the reports into consideration but when they get to the scene, but their actions should be based on what is actually happening. In this case, even if it had been a real rifle and the man was disturbed, his actions while the police were there did not post any imminent threat. Therefore, there was no need to shoot him. They would know that he wasn't raising his gun to shoot at them because he wasn't raising his gun at all.
    They didn't know it wasn't a real, high powered rifle. They had to react off the information they had, which was that he was a threat. The motion of raising the barrel of the rifle up, even the little bit, was a threatening motion. They could not have known why he did that. It was possible that he would have continued to move it up and shoot either the cops or civilians in the area. They are not mindreaders or psychics. They only know what is going on at that moment. And most training for police officers says that you don't give a person with a weapon time to shoot someone. If they make any moves that can be deemed as "threatening", as in they look like they might shoot, you can shoot them to stop the "threat".
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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  4. #354
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    They didn't know it wasn't a real, high powered rifle. They had to react off the information they had, which was that he was a threat.
    They didn't have any information that he was an imminent threat.

    The motion of raising the barrel of the rifle up, even the little bit, was a threatening motion. They could not have known why he did that.
    No, it's not and besides, he wasn't lifting the barrel up. He was lowering it.
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    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #355
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    She didn't move immediately out of the area. She lingered there for 10 seconds and when she left, she left her daughter behind. She also did not gesture to anyone.
    No. She didn't see him immediately. You can see that as soon as she turned her head, she shuffled both the children out. She didn't leave the daughter behind. She noticed that the daughter wasn't following immediately, and got her attention. Then you can see in the garden section that she is looking for people, making motions to get someone's attention, even looking like she was gesturing for someone to call someone. We don't know what she said, but it was definitely not normal for someone to do as she did. She felt threatened, even if just a little, by the guy carrying the rifle in the store.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  6. #356
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    They didn't have any information that he was an imminent threat.

    No, it's not and besides, he wasn't lifting the barrel up. He was lowering it.
    Yes, they did. It may have been bad information, but it was still information. Just like that whole "swatting" thing. Those incidents are based off of information about a person who is being viewed as a threat, an imminent threat.

    He was lifting it at at least one point after the police arrived. You can keep denying it, but it did happen.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  7. #357
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    She didn't move immediately out of the area. She lingered there for 10 seconds and when she left, she left her daughter behind. She also did not gesture to anyone.

    If she felt threatened by a crazy man with a gun, then why did she walk back into the with her children?

    Is that something a parent who feels their children's lives are threatened does?
    Yeah if that WalMart was anything like all the Walmarts in my city, the lawn and garden deparment has a separate entrance. If I felt threatened in any way, as a mother, I would have walked behind my child and got the hell out of the store. It makes no sense if a parent felt threatened by a man they thought had a gun, to leave a child behind and then not leave the store and even though she walked back in and headed supposedly the other way - if she felt threatened in any way why the hell did she go back through the door and risk anything to her children? I really can't speak for all mothers though some may react different but it just makes no sense to think she felt a threat and then put her children at risk.
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  8. #358
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No. She didn't see him immediately. You can see that as soon as she turned her head, she shuffled both the children out. She didn't leave the daughter behind. She noticed that the daughter wasn't following immediately, and got her attention. Then you can see in the garden section that she is looking for people, making motions to get someone's attention, even looking like she was gesturing for someone to call someone. We don't know what she said, but it was definitely not normal for someone to do as she did. She felt threatened, even if just a little, by the guy carrying the rifle in the store.
    The video does not show what you claim to have seen. The mother does look at him for a few seconds but she makes no gestures. Her hands remain on the shopping cart throughout the entire time.

    And she doesn't notice that her daughter was left behind. Look at 8:25:54:03 She is leaving the frame of the video camera inside the store and entering the view of the outside camera. The daughter is behind her still looking at something on the shelf and she makes not effort to gesture to her daughter. She doesn't turn around nor do her hands leave the shopping cart until she is outside

    When she goes outside, her hands are *still* on the shopping cart. She does lift them for about two seconds to fix her hair!! I don't know anyone who fixes their hair as a way to get someone's attention unless they're flirting with someone.
    Last edited by sangha; 10-03-14 at 11:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #359
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Yes, they did. It may have been bad information, but it was still information. Just like that whole "swatting" thing. Those incidents are based off of information about a person who is being viewed as a threat, an imminent threat.

    He was lifting it at at least one point after the police arrived. You can keep denying it, but it did happen.
    No, during the time the police are in the video, the gun is pointing down or being lowered
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #360
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The video does not show what you claim to have seen. The mother does look at him for a few seconds but she makes no gestures. Her hands remain on the shopping cart throughout the entire time.
    And you can't hear anything she says. It is obvious that she moves her children out of the area as soon as she actually sees him. That means that she felt some degree of threat from him.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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