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Thread: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    The caller also watched multiple people walk in and out of the aisle with no issues or threat, although he claimed there was - @ 8;25;44 he claims he pointed it at two children when he didn't even have it raised in the air.
    How would the cops know that?

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    I wanted to bring this in from the other thread because cj makes some excellent observations:

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    There's no need to deal in hypotheticals and "what ifs" - we have video evidence of the situation leading up to the shooting available to us. The only narrative is from the 911 caller and even though he falsely claims the suspect was loading the gun he also rightly claims, when the 911 operator asked what he's doing, said "no, he's not doing anything".

    And what's so wild about the idea that the suspect went to Walmart to buy a pellet gun and some cat food? Doesn't Walmart sell pellet guns and cat food? It's a far more likely scenario than wild conjecture that the kid was trying to commit suicide by cop. The only thing the suicide by cop diversion does is absolve the officer who killed him from taking responsibility for his hasty actions. And as noted above by another poster, let's not forget that this cowboy justice also led to another innocent person dying from a heart attack.

    The store surveillance equipment had the suspect in sight the whole time here. The prudent thing to do would have been for officers to assess the situation while the suspect was inactive, usher all other shoppers and staff out of the store calmly and quietly, and then approach the suspect in a calm and professional manner. Instead, it appears, the officer simply rushed in with execution on his mind determined to fire and take down the suspect without ever ascertaining what was going on.

    As I said previously, I'm very supportive of police and other law enforcement but not blindly so. There are bad police. There are incompetent police. There are rogue/cowboy cops. To dismiss the actions of this officer in this incident is foolish, in my view. Along with the privilege and authority of being a police officer, including carrying a weapon and being authorized to use it, come heightened responsibility and heightened judgement. This officer needs to be disciplined for lacking both and perhaps he will be or has been and we don't know it.

    Agreed.
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    How would the cops know that?
    They wouldn't have. I was talking about wishing the caller could get some kind of false police report charge since he was falsely reporting details that were proven wrong by the surveillance camera.
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Didn't we pass a law a while back where all air rifles that look even remotely "assault like" have orange tips? I'm not sure how you miss that...
    The orange tip is for toy guns; an air gun is not a toy.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    They wouldn't have. I was talking about wishing the caller could get some kind of false police report charge since he was falsely reporting details that were proven wrong by the surveillance camera.

    No, you don't want to start attaching potential criminal liabilities to 911 calls.

    Not unless it is a purposefull and blatant misrepresentation of the facts.

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Not unless it is a purposefully and blatant misrepresentation of the facts.
    Do you think in this case it was? To me it looked like he blatantly misrepresented the facts when he said said the guy was reloading and pointing guns at children when the surveillance shows otherwise.
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    It appears police had no reason to believe the rifle was from Walmart or an air rifle.
    And if it were a real rifle, does it warrant automatic execution?
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    Do you think in this case it was? To me it looked like he blatantly misrepresented the facts when he said said the guy was reloading and pointing guns at children when the surveillance shows otherwise.
    This is absolutely true - from the video, just before the suspect is shot, a mother and two kids enter the pet supplies aisle where the suspect is and while they don't appear to interact, the mother and kids don't appear to feel the least bit threatened and the suspect doesn't aim the rifle at them or even seem to acknowledge they're there.

    The connection of the video surveillance and the 911 audio is a little confusing to me because we're left with the impression that the caller is seeing exactly what's on the video when the truth is, I believe, that the caller is somewhere down in the store observing the suspect from a totally different angle. The caller may be seeing things we aren't in the video but it's clear his account of what the suspect is doing is patently false in many respects.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    This is absolutely true - from the video, just before the suspect is shot, a mother and two kids enter the pet supplies aisle where the suspect is and while they don't appear to interact, the mother and kids don't appear to feel the least bit threatened and the suspect doesn't aim the rifle at them or even seem to acknowledge they're there.

    The connection of the video surveillance and the 911 audio is a little confusing to me because we're left with the impression that the caller is seeing exactly what's on the video when the truth is, I believe, that the caller is somewhere down in the store observing the suspect from a totally different angle. The caller may be seeing things we aren't in the video but it's clear his account of what the suspect is doing is patently false in many respects.
    Do you believe that the officers should not be held accountable for their actions and the caller should be?
    A man without fear is a fool, a man that succumbs to his fear is a coward and a brave man acknowledges fear yet presses on.
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    Do you believe that the officers should not be held accountable for their actions and the caller should be?
    I've said numerous times here and on other threads that the officer should be held accountable for his actions.

    Personally, I don't believe the officer should have clearly been charged, there's room for doubt, but I also do not believe he should still be a police officer, at least not one who carries a weapon in public. I also believe, particularly in the US, this matter is ripe for a civil lawsuit definitely against the police, possibly against Walmart if the gun the suspect was carrying was store merchandise that wasn't properly contained before sale, and also possibly the 911 caller who appears, to me, to be falsely reporting to the 911 operator a scenario far more dangerous and potentially deadly than what clearly existed from the video. To use an old analogy, if you yell fire in a crowded movie theater and there's no fire and someone gets hurt or dies in the rush to exit, you are partially culpable/liable for the harm you cause.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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