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Thread: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

  1. #281
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by aseidner View Post
    Then perhaps we need to train police offers to be a little less trigger happy.

    .
    I would generally agree with that, but it depends on the situation.
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    As a matter of fact, my own son was far from perfect. Fortunately, it didn't get him killed, because he knew not to put himself in that position. Any other tidbits of wisdom you can give to me?
    Why yes, there is

    No matter how well your child succeeds in not doing anything that would alarm any reasonable person, there is nothing he can do to stop someone (like the idiot who called 911 in this case) from calling 911 and reporting that someone fitting the description of your child has a gun and is threatening people. And there's no telling if the police who respond mistakenly believe that the object your son is holding (ex a stick, a wallet, a lighter - all of which police have mistaken for a gun) is a gun and shoot him.

    When the police can shoot people, not because they are posing an imminent threat to others, but merely because they officer is scared, hyped-up, or ortherwise disturbed, then not even the most intelligent and well-behaved are safe from being shot by a police officer
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by aseidner View Post
    Then perhaps we need to train police offers to be a little less trigger happy.

    Here are the accounts of the police officers Officer narratives released in Beavercreek Walmart shooting | www.whio.com

    They claim he failed to comply with multiple commands to drop the weapon and that he turned towards the police in an aggressive manner. None of that is supported by the surveillance video. They give him less than two seconds to drop the gun before firing.
    How do you come to that conclusion? How does a soundless video offer so much information?

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    How do you come to that conclusion? How does a soundless video offer so much information?
    The video clearly shows that, contrary to the officer's account, Crawford did not turn towards the officer before he was shot
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The video clearly shows that, contrary to the officer's account, Crawford did not turn towards the officer before he was shot
    You might see a video (even one with no sound) and think that because you're seeing an actual sort of account of what happened, you know the whole story. And it's very rare that a video is actually going to be able to tell the whole story. I think just about every professor of Criminal Law would agree with that statement. The evidence given to the grand jury that we are not privy to didn't warrant an indictment of the officers. And we all know grand juries are known to indict a ham sandwich. Nevertheless, all the information has been turned over to the DOJ for further review.

  6. #286
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    How do you come to that conclusion? How does a soundless video offer so much information?
    The video is not soundless. You can hear them command Crawford to get down and immediately hear shots afterwards.

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    NO, they are not just as dangerous, and they are not classified as firearms in most places.
    I think that while air rifles similar to the one in this case are not classified as firearms (firearms produce energy by expoding gunpowder), they are classified as dangerous weapons. Toy weapons have the orange tips. Eveything else is assumed to be dangerous.

    IMO the police in this case had every reason to believe the weapon was dangerous. Whether they acted appropriately is another question.

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo View Post
    I think that while air rifles similar to the one in this case are not classified as firearms (firearms produce energy by expoding gunpowder), they are classified as dangerous weapons. Toy weapons have the orange tips. Eveything else is assumed to be dangerous.

    IMO the police in this case had every reason to believe the weapon was dangerous. Whether they acted appropriately is another question.
    They had reason, based on how it looked on first glance, and the caller reinforced that. They aren't typically classified as a weapon, but also aren't classified as toys- probably mostly for liability purposes, if I were to take a guess. I can fully understand why they did what they did. It was a terrible mistake, but I can understand the reasoning.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Why yes, there is

    No matter how well your child succeeds in not doing anything that would alarm any reasonable person, there is nothing he can do to stop someone (like the idiot who called 911 in this case) from calling 911 and reporting that someone fitting the description of your child has a gun and is threatening people. And there's no telling if the police who respond mistakenly believe that the object your son is holding (ex a stick, a wallet, a lighter - all of which police have mistaken for a gun) is a gun and shoot him.

    When the police can shoot people, not because they are posing an imminent threat to others, but merely because they officer is scared, hyped-up, or ortherwise disturbed, then not even the most intelligent and well-behaved are safe from being shot by a police officer
    If you don't act in a threatening manner, or do something really stupid such as running away, the cops have no reason to shoot. Everything this guy did was a red flag.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

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    Re: No indictment in police shooting death of Ohio man carrying air rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    You might see a video (even one with no sound) and think that because you're seeing an actual sort of account of what happened, you know the whole story. And it's very rare that a video is actually going to be able to tell the whole story. I think just about every professor of Criminal Law would agree with that statement. The evidence given to the grand jury that we are not privy to didn't warrant an indictment of the officers. And we all know grand juries are known to indict a ham sandwich. Nevertheless, all the information has been turned over to the DOJ for further review.
    Yes, it is impossible to look at a video of a man and tell if he turned around.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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