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US Intercepts 8 Russian Warplanes Near Alaska

Objective Voice said:
I just watched a couple of MiG-31 versus F-22 flight simulators. The F-22's won each time. The MiG's were detected several miles out while the F-22's went undetected except when they engaged their afterburners. Otherwise, the F-22 attained lock and fired their missiles and the MiG-31's never had a chance even when they detected the missles coming at them.

Granted, this was all simulations, but very impressive.

Curious, though...did Russia actually build the MiG-31 Firefox from the movie of the same name? (Re: Clint Eastwood era)
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The MIG-31 is actually called the Foxhound, not the Firefox. It was built to replace the Foxbat.
 
matchlight said:
If that's a problem, the obvious solution is never to let an opponent's aircraft close the range before shooting it down. It's like saying a highly skilled marksman with a top-notch sniper rifle is at a disadvantage, if he lets an enemy with a cheap snub-nosed revolver approach across open ground to within ten yards of him, because at such short range the revolver is so much more maneuverable and quicker to aim.
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I reckon somebody familiar with the avionics, targeting, and weapons systems on the F-22 would probably say that if they can't see you, they can't shoot you. I'm pretty sure they aren't concerned about its performance in air-to-air dogfighting. Tough to engage in a dogfight when pieces of your plane are headed south.
 
donsutherland1 said:
F-22s are operational. The F-35 is untested so to speak.

With respect to an in-close dogfight, that's a different matter. From ABC News:

The United States has spent nearly $80 billion to develop the most advanced stealth fighter jet in history, the F-22 Raptor, but the Air Force recently found out firsthand that while the planes own the skies at modern long-range air combat, it is “evenly matched” with cheaper, foreign jets when it comes to old-school dogfighting.

F-22 Raptor Loses $79 Billion Advantage in Dogfights: Report - ABC News
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Well the F-22 may be operational but there have been no reports that it has been involved in air combat as of yet so I am curious as to what it could do.

Also there was a report I read a few years ago about German Air Force pilots bragging that their Tornadoes were able to outmaneuver F-22s in a mock dogfight and shot them down in a simulation. While the top USAF brass may think dogfights are outdated, they felt the same way when they first deployed the F-4 Phantom over Vietnam and they didnt arm it with a cannon, thinking nobody would want to dogfight anymore- the North Vietnamese air force proved them wrong.
 
PoS said:
Well the F-22 may be operational but there have been no reports that it has been involved in air combat as of yet so I am curious as to what it could do.

Also there was a report I read a few years ago about German Air Force pilots bragging that their Tornadoes were able to outmaneuver F-22s in a mock dogfight and shot them down in a simulation. While the top USAF brass may think dogfights are outdated, they felt the same way when they first deployed the F-4 Phantom over Vietnam and they didnt arm it with a cannon, thinking nobody would want to dogfight anymore- the North Vietnamese air force proved them wrong.
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Read here: F-22 Raptor: Capabilities and Controversies
 
PoS said:
Well the F-22 may be operational but there have been no reports that it has been involved in air combat as of yet so I am curious as to what it could do.

Also there was a report I read a few years ago about German Air Force pilots bragging that their Tornadoes were able to outmaneuver F-22s in a mock dogfight and shot them down in a simulation. While the top USAF brass may think dogfights are outdated, they felt the same way when they first deployed the F-4 Phantom over Vietnam and they didnt arm it with a cannon, thinking nobody would want to dogfight anymore- the North Vietnamese air force proved them wrong.
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That would be hard to believe, since the F-22 has vectored thrust capability, a Tornado would not be able to turn with it, or operate in the same envelope.
 
Navy Pride said:
The scary part is the Russians have no fear of Obama.......They can do anything they want without fear of retribution.
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This is total BS!
 
Objective Voice said:
I just watched a couple of MiG-31 versus F-22 flight simulators. The F-22's won each time. The MiG's were detected several miles out while the F-22's went undetected except when they engaged their afterburners. Otherwise, the F-22 attained lock and fired their missiles and the MiG-31's never had a chance even when they detected the missles coming at them.

Granted, this was all simulations, but very impressive.

Curious, though...did Russia actually build the MiG-31 Firefox from the movie of the same name? (Re: Clint Eastwood era)
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I'm pretty sure the Movie and the book that is based on which I actually have read used a real plane as its basis or at least the name of a designation of class of Russian planes.
 
donsutherland1 said:
F-22s are operational. The F-35 is untested so to speak.

With respect to an in-close dogfight, that's a different matter. From ABC News:

The United States has spent nearly $80 billion to develop the most advanced stealth fighter jet in history, the F-22 Raptor, but the Air Force recently found out firsthand that while the planes own the skies at modern long-range air combat, it is “evenly matched” with cheaper, foreign jets when it comes to old-school dogfighting.

F-22 Raptor Loses $79 Billion Advantage in Dogfights: Report - ABC News
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Dog fights only happen in the movies now, the stealth aspect of the Raptor is not just for avoiding surface to air missiles but it, also, prevents enemy aircraft from attaining radar lock meaning that the only long range detection system which can see the Raptor is an infrared system which most planes (including these MIGs from the OP) are not equipped with and even if they are Infrared capable the Raptors own radar has a range appx. 3 times longer than even the Eurofighters P.I.R.A.T.E system which is far more advanced than anything the technologically backwards Russians can muster.
 
grip said:
There will remain a role for manned fighters for the next few decades, but I don't think they'll be produced in the same numbers as the last ones, F-18's etc. They have plans on ordering a bunch of F-35's but technology, costs and unmanned aircraft are quickly changing the concept of modern warfare.
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Even the F22 has more capabilities than a human pilot can handle.
 
MMC said:
Its not the Mig 31 we need to watch out for. Its their Mig 35.

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The MIG35 is not even a 4.5 Generation aircraft it is a 4th generation aircraft the F22 is a fully 5th generation aircraft, a single F22 is capable of taking on squadrons of MIG35's.
 
donsutherland1 said:
F-22s are operational. The F-35 is untested so to speak.

With respect to an in-close dogfight, that's a different matter. From ABC News:

The United States has spent nearly $80 billion to develop the most advanced stealth fighter jet in history, the F-22 Raptor, but the Air Force recently found out firsthand that while the planes own the skies at modern long-range air combat, it is “evenly matched” with cheaper, foreign jets when it comes to old-school dogfighting.

F-22 Raptor Loses $79 Billion Advantage in Dogfights: Report - ABC News
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I think Air Force doctrine took into account that the vast majority of fighter engagements in the modern age are BVR. This was the thinking behind the F-15.
 
PoS said:
Well the F-22 may be operational but there have been no reports that it has been involved in air combat as of yet so I am curious as to what it could do.

Also there was a report I read a few years ago about German Air Force pilots bragging that their Tornadoes were able to outmaneuver F-22s in a mock dogfight and shot them down in a simulation. While the top USAF brass may think dogfights are outdated, they felt the same way when they first deployed the F-4 Phantom over Vietnam and they didnt arm it with a cannon, thinking nobody would want to dogfight anymore- the North Vietnamese air force proved them wrong.
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A) Dog fights no longer happen except in the movies.

B) The F22 is still the superior dog fighter as it has thrust vectoring capabilities so they still beat the Germans advanced Eurofighter but the Germans were actually able to score some kills during that exercise scenario, however, during the actual exercise the Eurofighters got zero hits and were blown out of the sky before they even saw the Raptors.
 
Anthony60 said:
That would be hard to believe, since the F-22 has vectored thrust capability, a Tornado would not be able to turn with it, or operate in the same envelope.
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It wasn't the Tornado it was the Eurofighter which is their best and the Raptors still beat them in the dogfight scenario portion of the exercise, however, it was the only portion of the over all exercise in which the Eurofighters were able to score any points.
 
face said:
Dog fights only happen in the movies now, the stealth aspect of the Raptor is not just for avoiding surface to air missiles but it, also, prevents enemy aircraft from attaining radar lock meaning that the only long range detection system which can see the Raptor is an infrared system which most planes (including these MIGs from the OP) are not equipped with and even if they are Infrared capable the Raptors own radar has a range appx. 3 times longer than even the Eurofighters P.I.R.A.T.E system which is far more advanced than anything the technologically backwards Russians can muster.
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I agree, but the question to which I responded dealt with dogfights.
 
face said:
The MIG35 is not even a 4.5 Generation aircraft it is a 4th generation aircraft the F22 is a fully 5th generation aircraft, a single F22 is capable of taking on squadrons of MIG35's.
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Do the Russians think it is a 5th generation Fighter.....I don't think they were looking to take on Raptors with these. Now their Mig 37 is 5th generation.....correct?
 
MMC said:
Do the Russians think it is a 5th generation Fighter.....I don't think they were looking to take on Raptors with these. Now their Mig 37 is 5th generation.....correct?
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The MIG37 doesn't exist, the F22 Raptor is the only 5th Generation aircraft on the planet.

MiG-37

The MiG-37 (fictional NATO reporting name Ferret E) is a fictional stealth aircraft produced in kit form by Italian model manufacturer Italeri, in co-operation with American model company Testors. The kit was a follow-up to Testors' highly successful (and fictional) "F-19 Stealth" model kit.

The MiG-37 is a stealth fighter designed using advances in technology from the Soviet Union's space and aviation programs as a reaction to the American F-19 stealth project.

Fictional military aircraft - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
putin is like a rodent trying to show off to a rhino.

Too bad Russia has nukes.
 
face said:
The MIG37 doesn't exist, the F22 Raptor is the only 5th Generation aircraft on the planet.

MiG-37

The MiG-37 (fictional NATO reporting name Ferret E) is a fictional stealth aircraft produced in kit form by Italian model manufacturer Italeri, in co-operation with American model company Testors. The kit was a follow-up to Testors' highly successful (and fictional) "F-19 Stealth" model kit.

The MiG-37 is a stealth fighter designed using advances in technology from the Soviet Union's space and aviation programs as a reaction to the American F-19 stealth project.

Fictional military aircraft - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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The SU 37 now is a modified SU 35.



300px-Sukhoi_Su-37_at_Farnborough_1996_airshow.jpg




300px-Sukhoi_Su-47_Berkut_%28S-37%29_in_2001.jpg


also designated S-32 and S-37 (not to be confused with the twin-engined delta canard design[1] offered by Sukhoi in the early 1990s under the designation Su-37) during initial development, was an experimental supersonic jet fighter developed by Sukhoi Aviation Corporation. A distinguishing feature of the aircraft was its forward-swept wing[2] that gave the aircraft excellent agility and maneuverability. While serial production of the type never materialized, the sole aircraft produced served as a technology demonstrator prototype for a number of advanced technologies later used in the 4.5 generation fighter SU-35BM and current fifth-generation jet fighter prototype Sukhoi PAK FA T-50.

th


Their PAKFA T 50.....Stealth Fighter.....along with the 47 they think they have our Raptors outclassed. As they will be flying together.
 
face said:
Even the F22 has more capabilities than a human pilot can handle.
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The F-22 is probably the last version of an advanced manned fighter will see. They'll update the platform as tech advances, but the allure of unmanned fighters and their increasing improvements will probably be the future. A human flying a Raptor will cost more, and may not even be capable of outfighting an automated system with robot speed and precision.
 
grip said:
The F-22 is probably the last version of an advanced manned fighter will see. They'll update the platform as tech advances, but the allure of unmanned fighters and their increasing improvements will probably be the future. A human flying a Raptor will cost more, and may not even be capable of outfighting an automated system with robot speed and precision.
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Heya Grip. :2wave: Yeah and that was something the US Space Command even brought up. Robot pilots.
 
Almost in the subject. Alaska generally is controversial State. It seems to belong to us, but is far and quite independent.
And earthquakes at Alaska is nothing more that attempts to come back to Mother Russia. North to the north, polar bears want to join their families)))
 
MMC said:
The SU 37 now is a modified SU 35.



300px-Sukhoi_Su-37_at_Farnborough_1996_airshow.jpg




300px-Sukhoi_Su-47_Berkut_%28S-37%29_in_2001.jpg


also designated S-32 and S-37 (not to be confused with the twin-engined delta canard design[1] offered by Sukhoi in the early 1990s under the designation Su-37) during initial development, was an experimental supersonic jet fighter developed by Sukhoi Aviation Corporation. A distinguishing feature of the aircraft was its forward-swept wing[2] that gave the aircraft excellent agility and maneuverability. While serial production of the type never materialized, the sole aircraft produced served as a technology demonstrator prototype for a number of advanced technologies later used in the 4.5 generation fighter SU-35BM and current fifth-generation jet fighter prototype Sukhoi PAK FA T-50.

th


Their PAKFA T 50.....Stealth Fighter.....along with the 47 they think they have our Raptors outclassed. As they will be flying together.
Click to expand...


It has flight vectoring but no stealth so it's at most a 4.5 generation fighter which has absolutely 0 chance against the raptor which would shoot it out of the sky before they ever saw it, furthermore, as you said it never went into production and the PAK FA has likewise not gone into production either and by the time it does the F22 will be upgraded, basically it will be obsolete before it's even delivered.
 
grip said:
The F-22 is probably the last version of an advanced manned fighter will see. They'll update the platform as tech advances, but the allure of unmanned fighters and their increasing improvements will probably be the future. A human flying a Raptor will cost more, and may not even be capable of outfighting an automated system with robot speed and precision.
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The human body is incapable of handling the G's which the maneuverability of the F22 allows for it's resulted in a few accidents related to black outs IIRC.
 
face said:
The human body is incapable of handling the G's which the maneuverability of the F22 allows for it's resulted in a few accidents related to black outs IIRC.
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They've developed a new Anti-G suit since the F-16 version, with better coverage that helps with the F-22 and F-35's power. Most pilots from their training can handle a sustained 8-9 G pull for a few seconds. The F-22 was having problems at high altitudes with pilots blacking out and becoming faint from hypoxia. Ironically, the Air Force now believes that a key problem was a valve in the pilots’ pressure vest that caused it to inflate and remain inflated, triggering breathing problems. Besides changes being made to the fighter’s oxygen system, the Air Force is replacing the valve and increasing the volume of air flowing to the pilots by removing a filter that was installed to check for contaminants in the system. They also installed a new backup emergency oxygen system, added sensors and put in an improved pilot oxygen center.
 
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