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Thread: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Yeah, well maybe the US should just invade Canada and Mexico and take them over......

    Same situation here.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    That wasn't the case in the UK. No one asked the people of the UK. It was a decision taken purely by politicians, just as no one is asking the people of Spain.
    The big difference is that no one raised constitutional objections in the UK. Constitutional objections have been raised in Spain. If Spain's constitutional court upholds those objections, then the constitution would need to be revised to permit such a vote. Spain's political leaders will heed public sentiment prior to making any such consequential move, as any democratic society should.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Don't lie to me! We all know it's cause your prettier! :P
    And, sexier...
    Everything in your life is a reflection of a choice you have made. If you want a different result, don't blame someone else, or expect others to make a change, you should stop complaining and make a different choice. Remember, the circumstances of your birth don't determine the outcome of your life.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Yeah, well maybe the US should just invade Canada and Mexico and take them over......

    Same situation here.
    If we had done so 300 years ago, then yeah, it would be the same. Oh, and by the way, we that did already and now parts of those countries are now US states or parts of US states...
    Everything in your life is a reflection of a choice you have made. If you want a different result, don't blame someone else, or expect others to make a change, you should stop complaining and make a different choice. Remember, the circumstances of your birth don't determine the outcome of your life.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    The big difference is that no one raised constitutional objections in the UK. Constitutional objections have been raised in Spain. If Spain's constitutional court upholds those objections, then the constitution would need to be revised to permit such a vote. Spain's political leaders will heed public sentiment prior to making any such consequential move, as any democratic society should.
    I guess thats one of the beauties of not having a written constitution as the UK, you can make it up as you go along.

    The Catalans get stuck in 'the constitution doesn't allow it' argument made by Madrid against allowing any independence referendum
    I support the right to keep and arm bears

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Tonic View Post
    I guess thats one of the beauties of not having a written constitution as the UK, you can make it up as you go along.

    The Catalans get stuck in 'the constitution doesn't allow it' argument made by Madrid against allowing any independence referendum
    Although the UK has no formal constitution, it has a deep body of law.

    As secession is not a trivial matter, I don't fault Spain's political leaders for ensuring that constitutional authority exists for such a move. Secession should not be an automatic remedy for light matters. I don't see anything that really rises to the level necessary to suggest that the Catalans cannot reasonably enjoy basic rights and full economic and political participation within Spain.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    If we had done so 300 years ago, then yeah, it would be the same. Oh, and by the way, we that did already and now parts of those countries are now US states or parts of US states...
    Yeah well we paid for that land via honest transaction. The United States has NEVER conquered and stole land - the US always paid. It was either done thought payment or democracy...

    So don't attempt to portray the US as the Roman Empire or the Ottomans or whatever "empire" suits your argument.

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Tonic View Post
    I guess thats one of the beauties of not having a written constitution as the UK, you can make it up as you go along.

    The Catalans get stuck in 'the constitution doesn't allow it' argument made by Madrid against allowing any independence referendum
    Please stop with this "you can make it up as you go along" lie. The fact that it gets old is old. There may not be a single document headed "British Constitution" for the simple-minded to refer to, but much of the constitution was put into writing long before the USA was discovered. Combined with hundreds of years of court records, statutes, and parliamentary precedent and convention, the constitution is alive and well. Magna Carta anyone? Try the Declaration of Arbroath from 1320. It's a guide for the later declaration made 600 years later.
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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Would the decision have even been legally binding? Who set up the vote? Who regulated the voting procedure?

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    Re: Scotland Rejects Independence From Britain in a Close Vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post

    A state that is forcing a region or constituent nation to remain within the state against the wishes of the people of that region is itself inherently unstable. It is being held together through coercion. We have already had the commander of the Guardia Civil (paramilitary police) stating that he believes that if called upon, he would be prepared to use any means necessary to prevent the Catalans holding a referendum.

    There is no broad consensus of the appropriate constitutional and legal framework for the future. The Catalans are being forcibly prevented from expressing their democratic will.
    So what you're saying is you support the right of any minority group anywhere in the world setting up shop within the territory constituted by a lager demographic and then holding a referendum for independence and then expecting the larger demographic going along with such a thing? I thought socialists were supposed to be anti-Nationalistic, what you're talking about is radical nationalism. Furthermore; the Catalans have complete freedom of movement they are not being held within the state against their will they are free to leave the state at any time they choose and move elsewhere within the EU or whatever country that will take them.
    Last edited by face, your; 09-20-14 at 12:19 AM.

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