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Thread: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    They were Christian racist in origin.
    And a lot of them originally came from the UK also. What are we to make of that??

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The KKK were not Christian in origin, the were racist in origin.
    ISIL is not Islamic in origin they are revolutionaries in origin.
    "The side that stays within its fortifications is beaten." ~Napoleon

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    They have decent people of any poltical stripe trying to distance them from Christianity. Nice try to blame this on liberals, which is kind of like you unfortunately.
    Oh dood...you are so full of **** its scary. Anytime it is convenient, liberals rush to drag them in as an example of 'Christianity'. Every liberal? No. But plenty of them? You bet.

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Unrepresented View Post
    ISIL is not Islamic in origin they are revolutionaries in origin.
    Revolutionary Muslims, yes. And what is the object of their 'revolution', their end ambition?

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But I would argue that there isn't wide-spread support for it. If there was, then ISIS/ISIL wouldn't have to be attacking these Muslim countries, they wouldn't have to be fighting in Syria and Iraq and Iran and the Muslim parts of India. Those countries would simply turn themselves over to ISIS/ISIL control. There is widespread opposition among the Muslim nations against these Islamic extremist groups. However, what makes this different is that these groups have the ability and freedom to act in that part of the world because they have the money and the freedom to act as an Islamic group. There is no secular influence moderating the religious insanity in the Middle East. This kind of thing could never happen in the west.

    And no, while I would say that there's something wrong with Islam, just like there's something wrong with every religion, the only one you can blame for the actions of that kid is that kid. There was something seriously wrong with that kid's brain wiring.
    When I say wide spread support, I'm referring to polls that have consistently showed that the majority are in support of Sharia Law being implemented (or more strictly) or for violent acts against civilian targets. There was an Al Jazeera poll about a year or so ago, where they asked whether they wanted a more secular Sharia Law, and only 33% of those did. The rest, preferred a more violent application of Islam and Sharia Law. Or how about in 2010, when another poll showed that half of Arabs supported Bin Laden. Or just look at the elections that have been had in this countries. Instead of electing moderate, secular governments, they keep electing in religious radicals like in Egypt with the Brotherhood, or in Iraq where they keep electing Maliki. Also, to your point, just because their is violence between muslims, doesn't make them any less dangerous. The whole reason ISIS got a foothold in Iraq, was the ****ty why that the Shia was treating the Sunni. This is why ISIS found such inroads into Iraq, because the Sunnis (of which, ISIS is as well) were sick and tired of being oppressed.

    Also, it's not like the MacArthur kids is the first western Muslim to resort to violence against their own country you know? You have the shooter at Ft. Hood for one. The London bombings were carried out by English men.

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Unrepresented View Post
    ISIL is not Islamic in origin they are revolutionaries in origin.
    The organization isn't called RSIL though is it?

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    When I say wide spread support, I'm referring to polls that have consistently showed that the majority are in support of Sharia Law being implemented (or more strictly) or for violent acts against civilian targets. There was an Al Jazeera poll about a year or so ago, where they asked whether they wanted a more secular Sharia Law, and only 33% of those did. The rest, preferred a more violent application of Islam and Sharia Law. Or how about in 2010, when another poll showed that half of Arabs supported Bin Laden. Or just look at the elections that have been had in this countries. Instead of electing moderate, secular governments, they keep electing in religious radicals like in Egypt with the Brotherhood, or in Iraq where they keep electing Maliki. Also, to your point, just because their is violence between muslims, doesn't make them any less dangerous. The whole reason ISIS got a foothold in Iraq, was the ****ty why that the Shia was treating the Sunni. This is why ISIS found such inroads into Iraq, because the Sunnis (of which, ISIS is as well) were sick and tired of being oppressed.

    Also, it's not like the MacArthur kids is the first western Muslim to resort to violence against their own country you know? You have the shooter at Ft. Hood for one. The London bombings were carried out by English men.
    And more Islamists, like Richard Reid as another example, will continue to carry out terrorist attacks at western targets. They are an army of individuals who are not fearful of being killed or going to jail.

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    In fact it was Christian theology which helped end slavery, but perhaps we should focus on what many Muslims are up to today.
    I've actually made the point that, according to some claims, only 15-20% of Muslims are radicalized. If that's really the case, then why don't the 80-85% of non-radicalized Muslims stand up and stop the crazies? To some degree, the U.S. has a bit of that responsibility, there are cases where we've actively helped the radicals to stomp on the peaceful demonstrating Muslims, but for the most part, it's because the non-radicals aren't willing to put themselves on the line to fight back. I get it, of course, but I can't help thinking that some part of it is because Islam, as a religion, doesn't allow the non-radicals to take up arms against their radical brethren, the religion gets in the way.

    I don't know, I just know that it's a mess.

    And Christian theology fell on both sides of the slavery conflict, proving that the Bible is just the Big Book of Multiple Choice. Anyone can get anything they want out of it by cherry picking. The same is likely true of the Qur'an.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    No, it was not. But, even if it were, what is your point in deflecting from the topic of "ISIL Is Not Islamic" when it is clear it is? Mohammed was quite clear on the subject.
    Well it is at least clear that you wish to wage war on the entire religion of 1.6 billion followers. That is just nuts.

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    Re: Obama: "ISIL Is Not Islamic"

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    When I say wide spread support, I'm referring to polls that have consistently showed that the majority are in support of Sharia Law being implemented (or more strictly) or for violent acts against civilian targets. There was an Al Jazeera poll about a year or so ago, where they asked whether they wanted a more secular Sharia Law, and only 33% of those did. The rest, preferred a more violent application of Islam and Sharia Law. Or how about in 2010, when another poll showed that half of Arabs supported Bin Laden. Or just look at the elections that have been had in this countries. Instead of electing moderate, secular governments, they keep electing in religious radicals like in Egypt with the Brotherhood, or in Iraq where they keep electing Maliki. Also, to your point, just because their is violence between muslims, doesn't make them any less dangerous. The whole reason ISIS got a foothold in Iraq, was the ****ty why that the Shia was treating the Sunni. This is why ISIS found such inroads into Iraq, because the Sunnis (of which, ISIS is as well) were sick and tired of being oppressed.

    Also, it's not like the MacArthur kids is the first western Muslim to resort to violence against their own country you know? You have the shooter at Ft. Hood for one. The London bombings were carried out by English men.
    A lot of that is because these radical groups tend to provide for the people. When you're starving and the local radical group shows up with truck loads of food, you don't tend to ask too many questions about their politics, so long as they keep feeding you. In many places, the radicalized groups are more humanitarian than the governments that are in place.

    And let's be honest, you're talking about a couple of individuals out of how many Muslims in the United States? What's the percentage of American Muslims that go to fight for ISIS or shoot up military bases? How many zeroes do we have to put in front to have an accurate percentage? .000000000001%? Let's not act like this is an epidemic.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

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