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Thread: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Luftwaffe View Post
    Make your own vote?

    Is this the post you want to vote for or the post where I said 1 million Iraqis aren't even worth a single American soldier?
    My vote...stay out of that mess. None of America's business.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Luftwaffe View Post
    I'm all about whatever we decide to do as long as it doesn't involve troops back in Iraq. If air bombing isn't the answer because people complain it does nothing, what else can we do? What else is stronger?

    I like two options.

    #1 nuke Iraq and parts of Syria

    #2 Stay out of Iraq and Syria, it's their problem we're done, they wanna complain so hard then maybe they can do something for change.
    I think the below image might fit your mindset:

    la-na-tt-dick-cheney-advice-20140625-002.jpg
    To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what hes doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I don't think anybody denies that IS is a threat in some form or fashion.
    Oh I disagree. I think people are sleepwalking again. We have the luxury of living in a 'safe' country. By and large, our presidents have done a good job of combating terrorist attacks. Anyone that thinks you can stop ALL terror attacks is not being realistic. Clinton wasnt negligent the first time the World Trade center was bombed. Bush was not negligent. Obama is not negligent. "There might be at some point in time a terrorist attack" is not actionable intel. I believe Homeland Security is investigating and acting as well as they can. The trick is finding the balance between doing all you can and trampling on US citizens rights.

    The only REAL solution is to make the message clearly known and understood...we will hold the head of the snake accountable. Thats why I believe it is a mistake to NOT confront ISIS where we can SEE them operating. I think Obama has done exactly the right thing engaging them (even if he waited too long to do so).

    I also believe that one of the reasons we are sleepwalking as a country is that the incidents involving Muslim fundamentalists are being downplayed. Every time there has been a terror attack involving a Muslim the administration and the media have gone out of their way to downplay it, or to rush to point out well golly...its not ALL Muslims. No...its NOT all Muslims...but we SHOULD be concerned about EVERY fundamentalist/extremist Muslim. We as a country and hell...EVERY Muslim.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Oh I disagree. I think people are sleepwalking again. We have the luxury of living in a 'safe' country. By and large, our presidents have done a good job of combating terrorist attacks. Anyone that thinks you can stop ALL terror attacks is not being realistic. Clinton wasnt negligent the first time the World Trade center was bombed. Bush was not negligent. Obama is not negligent. "There might be at some point in time a terrorist attack" is not actionable intel. I believe Homeland Security is investigating and acting as well as they can. The trick is finding the balance between doing all you can and trampling on US citizens rights.

    The only REAL solution is to make the message clearly known and understood...we will hold the head of the snake accountable. Thats why I believe it is a mistake to NOT confront ISIS where we can SEE them operating. I think Obama has done exactly the right thing engaging them (even if he waited too long to do so).

    I also believe that one of the reasons we are sleepwalking as a country is that the incidents involving Muslim fundamentalists are being downplayed. Every time there has been a terror attack involving a Muslim the administration and the media have gone out of their way to downplay it, or to rush to point out well golly...its not ALL Muslims. No...its NOT all Muslims...but we SHOULD be concerned about EVERY fundamentalist/extremist Muslim. We as a country and hell...EVERY Muslim.
    Well I appreciate your opinion, but, those that aren't making too much out of IS (with its 10-15 thousand fighters, and its capacity which is absolutely little threat to the US military) are the same people, generally, complaining that it's US policies in the Middle East that have emboldened IS and other militant Islamic groups to begin with.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    Irrelevant.

    Simply because two administrations in a row underestimated the Al Qaeda threat does not mean that ISIS is automatically about to blow up Washington. Because Obama had an agenda of "I stopped racism" in an election does not mean that the US need start nuking the region as some have openly suggested...and let's include Iran because they will have the bomb any day now. And we never hear about how the terrorists came to live among you\even after being under suspicion at one time, take flying lessons in your schools while taking months to study your security....

    Sooner or later a frightened populace needs to take a look at the real evidence and decide whether living in a military state is worth it.

    Syria/Iraq is not a security issue, it is purely political, staging for the mid terms, with the hawks trying to make Obama a dove, and Obama trying to make it look like he knows where to take a dump.

    Fact - more people die EVERY year on US highways than all the foreign terrorists deaths of civilians.
    Fact - NOT ONE terrorist has ever successfully penetrated US security.
    Fact - there have been more deaths through domestic security than foreign
    Fact - 14 years of continuous warfare, half of it on two fronts, an aggressive drone killing campaign and billions in aid to stop terrorism and the problem is worse.


    So, let's do more of what we've been doing.
    You dont have to live in a military state to be vigilant in fighting terrorism. You have to be conscious and aware and when possible, you have to attack the head of the snake so they know to stay under their little rock. That doesnt require nukes and it DOES require exercising better intel. It also requires better cooperation with non-fundamentalist states and better education/awareness progress throughout the ME.

    There are better models to follow in places like Iraq. They will never be a US style democracy. They dont have to be controlled by a brutal dictator like Saddam. Both Bush and Obama have done a dismal job of engaging Muslim leaders in helping Iraq establish a healthy government.

    You are simply wrong if you believe ISIS is not a threat because they are 'only' butchering people in Iraq and Syria.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    You dont have to live in a military state to be vigilant in fighting terrorism. You have to be conscious and aware and when possible, you have to attack the head of the snake so they know to stay under their little rock. That doesnt require nukes and it DOES require exercising better intel. It also requires better cooperation with non-fundamentalist states and better education/awareness progress throughout the ME.

    There are better models to follow in places like Iraq. They will never be a US style democracy. They dont have to be controlled by a brutal dictator like Saddam. Both Bush and Obama have done a dismal job of engaging Muslim leaders in helping Iraq establish a healthy government.

    You are simply wrong if you believe ISIS is not a threat because they are 'only' butchering people in Iraq and Syria.
    They were under their little rock until the US flipped the damn thing over is the freaking point!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Well I appreciate your opinion, but, those that aren't making too much out of IS (with its 10-15 thousand fighters, and its capacity which is absolutely little threat to the US military) are the same people, generally, complaining that it's US policies in the Middle East that have emboldened IS and other militant Islamic groups to begin with.
    What has emboldened them is the belief that we will not engage. They can also trust that our politicians (and a large number of our citizens) only give a damn about votes and elections and will spend more time blaming the 'other guys' than they will engaging the enemy.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    What year did it happen--2001--since that's your standard for President Obama .
    All of the visas were issued before 2001 and all of the terrorist became illegal aliens before 2001, except for one.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    They were under their little rock until the US flipped the damn thing over is the freaking point!
    No...they werent. Fundamentalists have ALWAYS existed in that region. Fundamentalists are not progressive...they arent liberty minded...they dont believe in a happy peaceful world where we will all live together in harmony. We didnt 'create' fundamentalists.

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    Re: U.S. confirms Islamic State planning infiltration of southern border

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Indeed. And the left rolls out Orwell when it suites the meme and the right rolls him out when it suits theirs and they both trivialise the others. Which is why I always maintain that a partisan is part of the problem. Otherwise I can't tell if Orwell was a prophet or whether US leadership has mistaken his work for a manual. Either way we've trouble on our hands.
    I don't think either when reading Orwell, that government was neither....and it's been my experience that both sides as as guilty as the others. And yes, both trivialize....usually with never having read it. And you have a point, the US across two regimes has seemed to favor Orwell as handbook

    There is no mistake though, that Animal Farm is based on the 1930's image of the collective.....but it really is a story about totalitarianism.
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
    Donald Trump, 11/23/17

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