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Thread: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

  1. #251
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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    I'm not making excuses for anyone. I am responding to your claim that we don't have social classes in the USA. The fact is that the overwhelming majority of people born poor will only rise up a couple of steps on the economic ladder and those born upper class and wealthy will remain upper class and wealthy. A few exceptions don't change that reality. Your parent's income is the best predictor of your future economic success. Fact. It is not class warfare to recognize that we have classes.
    I said we don't have different classes. Different classes of citizens. Economic groups? Yes. But not classes of citizens. You can continue to make excuses and continue to say that poor people will stay poor. You are only preaching the same self fulfilling prophecy that the class warfare and race hatred industry preaches, which actually makes people think that they don't have a chance in this county. Again, I refuse to buy into that. I came from poverty, and have risen up. I came from poor white trash, but rose up. I have a friend that rose from poor black poverty and now owns a company that makes millions of dollars and employs hundreds of people. I refuse to buy into your doom and gloom narrative.
    Everything in your life is a reflection of a choice you have made. If you want a different result, don't blame someone else, or expect others to make a change, you should stop complaining and make a different choice. Remember, the circumstances of your birth don't determine the outcome of your life.

  2. #252
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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    "Feral lions and bears"

    I have rarely seen such a desperate attempt to support racism.

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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    I said we don't have different classes. Different classes of citizens. Economic groups? Yes. But not classes of citizens. You can continue to make excuses and continue to say that poor people will stay poor. You are only preaching the same self fulfilling prophecy that the class warfare and race hatred industry preaches, which actually makes people think that they don't have a chance in this county. Again, I refuse to buy into that. I came from poverty, and have risen up. I came from poor white trash, but rose up. I have a friend that rose from poor black poverty and now owns a company that makes millions of dollars and employs hundreds of people. I refuse to buy into your doom and gloom narrative.
    Many studies have reached similar conclusions as this one:
    "....In 1971 a child from the poorest fifth had an 8.4% chance of making it to the top quintile. For a child born in 1986 the odds were 9%. The study confirms previous findings that America’s social mobility is low compared with many European countries. (In Denmark, a poor child has twice as much chance of making it to the top quintile as in America.)...

    ...the probability of a child born into the poorest fifth of the population in San Jose, California making it to the top is 12.9%, not much lower than in Denmark. In Charlotte, North Carolina it is 4.4%, far lower than anywhere else in the rich world.

    This geographic prism also offers some pointers on what influences mobility. The economists found five factors that were correlated with differences in social mobility in different parts of America: residential segregation (whether by income or race); the quality of schooling; family structure (eg, how many children live with only one parent); “social capital” (such as taking part in community groups); and inequality (particularly income gaps among those outside the top 1%). Social mobility is higher in integrated places with good schools, strong families, lots of community spirit and smaller income gaps within the broad middle class. "


    Class in America: Mobility, measured | The Economist

    Try to prove otherwise with evidence better than a few anecdotes.

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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    I was responding to the statement from Beaudreaux., so ask him.

    However, rioting is mostly done by people at the bottom of the socio-economic ladder. AFAIK there was no political intent in this incident, so that is not an excuse for their acts, just a fact.

    .................................................. ..............
    Apparently you are unaware of the Democratic National Convention ? Or the entire decade of the 1960s into the 1970s..?? Economics is not a basis for rioting ... attitude and expectations carry the day..... economics has minimal influence save for those trying to excuse, blame, or apologize.

    I have lived what I speak.

    my 2 cents
    Remember, on the other side of that screen is a real person. ( Missouri Mule )

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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Thom Paine View Post
    Apparently you are unaware of the Democratic National Convention ? Or the entire decade of the 1960s into the 1970s..?? Economics is not a basis for rioting ... attitude and expectations carry the day..... economics has minimal influence save for those trying to excuse, blame, or apologize.

    I have lived what I speak.

    my 2 cents
    I remember the 1960s and most riots were in poor black neighborhoods. Most student/anti-war protests were not riots. The 1968 Chicago riot during the Democratic convention was a police riot.

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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Many studies have reached similar conclusions as this one:
    "....In 1971 a child from the poorest fifth had an 8.4% chance of making it to the top quintile. For a child born in 1986 the odds were 9%. The study confirms previous findings that America’s social mobility is low compared with many European countries. (In Denmark, a poor child has twice as much chance of making it to the top quintile as in America.)...

    ...the probability of a child born into the poorest fifth of the population in San Jose, California making it to the top is 12.9%, not much lower than in Denmark. In Charlotte, North Carolina it is 4.4%, far lower than anywhere else in the rich world.

    This geographic prism also offers some pointers on what influences mobility. The economists found five factors that were correlated with differences in social mobility in different parts of America: residential segregation (whether by income or race); the quality of schooling; family structure (eg, how many children live with only one parent); “social capital” (such as taking part in community groups); and inequality (particularly income gaps among those outside the top 1%). Social mobility is higher in integrated places with good schools, strong families, lots of community spirit and smaller income gaps within the broad middle class. "


    Class in America: Mobility, measured | The Economist

    Try to prove otherwise with evidence better than a few anecdotes.

    Pshaw...

    Almost no working individual reaches the top income quintile at age 26...

    Do better.

    Any type of socio-economic excuse for such actions is woefully misplaced.

    Thom Paine
    Remember, on the other side of that screen is a real person. ( Missouri Mule )

  7. #257
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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    I said we don't have different classes. Different classes of citizens. Economic groups? Yes. But not classes of citizens. You can continue to make excuses and continue to say that poor people will stay poor. You are only preaching the same self fulfilling prophecy that the class warfare and race hatred industry preaches, which actually makes people think that they don't have a chance in this county. Again, I refuse to buy into that. I came from poverty, and have risen up. I came from poor white trash, but rose up. I have a friend that rose from poor black poverty and now owns a company that makes millions of dollars and employs hundreds of people. I refuse to buy into your doom and gloom narrative.


    You know what? I did too. I grew up in a 50' mobile home in rural western New York. I rose up to being a national broadcaster, home owner and eventually a businessman employing people in job that would not have been there.

    There may be 'classes' as defined by those who need definitions, but there are no class barriers that I can see.

    One of my employees was crack baby who overcame the addiction which he inherited. He worked up to supervisor then, with my blessing moved on to a better job in a bigger company. Another was a half black man, born in Canada who was raised in suburban Seattle in fine digs, a speed boat to play with whenever he wanted it, his own basketball court. He was a good worker, but would disappear a lot, not show up for weeks...as he succumbed to his crack habit, which he blamed on growing up black in the United States.

    Oh, the first guy was half Cree....

    The point is not to in any way suggest one race is better than another, but that in all of them there are people who can and will rise above the circumstances they were born into and those who blame their circumstances on their failures, a trait of the sitting president.

    But in the end, isn't the point of America, and Canada to give those seeking to rise above the circumstances they were born into a CHANCE top do so?
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
    Donald Trump, 11/23/17

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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    "What Pew found was that in the bottom and top quintiles, mobility is "sticky." That is, if you were born into a family in the bottom 20 percent of the population, your chances of moving a rung or two higher was much less than if you were born into the next three quintiles. And if you were born into the top 20 percent, your chances of dropping by a rung or more was much less than if you were born into next lower quintiles."




    http://inequalitiesblog.wordpress.co...omic-mobility/


    As I said, several studies have reached similar conclusions about the amount of upward mobility in the USA.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 09-09-14 at 04:59 PM.

  9. #259
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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Are you saying that different classes of people exist? Are you saying that in those classes different cultures are accepted that are not in other classes? Or are you talking about income rather than class sine to otherwise would be to turn this from a diversion based on race to a diversion based on class of the perpetrators? I refuse to discuss or agree that different classes exist. We are all equal citizens. We all equal opportunity. However, equal opportunity does not translate to equal outcome.

    And as for the kids in the video, I have no idea what income level they come from. What difference does that make? And, why should it? Does a lower or higher income level give a person an entitlement to be violent, or restrict a person from being violent? What does how much money you have, have to do with the way you treat others?
    Questions are not answers to questions.

    You said that you wanted to talk about their culture, but when I asked you questions about their culture your response is basically "I don't know"

    WIll you ever actually identify this culture you're talking about, or will continue to dodge?

    on edit: You also claimed that anyone who allowed this to happen was accepting it so I asked you what you were doing to not allow it. You dodged that question also.
    Last edited by sangha; 09-09-14 at 05:15 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #260
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    Re: More than 100 teens swarm Memphis plaza, 'knocking out' shoppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Refusing to see socio-economic class differences means that you refuse to see reality. We are theoretically equal under the law, but even that ideal has not been achieved. A person's socio-economic class determines he quality of the education they receive, even in public schools, and how they will be treated by police and the rest of the justice system. In the private sector there are no legal protections for social classes and class discrimination is standard operating procedure.
    I'm waiting for him to claim that he doesn't see color or race.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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