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Thread: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents[W:76]

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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents[W:76]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Police, at least in many jurisdictions, can shoot fleeing suspects. I've posted the link a couple of times but there are so many of these threads.

    And since I havent heard of any cases like you described, hopefully it is/would be a rarity. People can do that with a lot of laws, but generally dont. Forensics are pretty good these days....it would require perfect staging.
    Police will be scrutinized and have to justify that the fleeing suspect was a threat to the public. They simply cannot shoot a suspect for running away if they cannot verbally articulate why the suspect was a potential threat. This is why Wilson is on shaky ground when it comes to shooting at Brown while he was running away from him (even if none of them hit and assuming he did), because the SCOTUS has already ruled that police are not allowed to shoot a suspect for simply stealing property in Tennessee v Gardner. The police cannot simply say "that guy stole this guy's stuff, so I shot him because I couldn't foresee any other way to retrieve the property", but a regular citizen can say "he stole my stuff so I shot him as he ran away" and be justified.

    Texas justifiable homicides rise with 'Castle Doctrine' - Houston Chronicle

    This type of law does lead to the cases we see that someone simply sees someone on their property, even if it is for an innocent purpose, and they end up killing that person. I just wish there was a middle ground. This allows a person to literally run after someone who has stolen from them and shoot at them so long as the person is within range. I would hope that if they ended up shooting someone else, that they would get charged, but it does increase the possibility of them shooting an innocent bystander in their mad rush to protect their property.

    Luckily, these incidents, although increasing, are still rare in themselves.
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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents[W:76]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Yes, you can. And here's the law:

    9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is
    justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or
    tangible, movable property:
    (1) if he would be justified in using force against the
    other under Section 9.41; and
    (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the
    deadly force is immediately necessary:
    (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of
    arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the
    nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
    (B) to prevent the other who is fleeing
    immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated
    robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the
    property; and
    (3) he reasonably believes that:
    (A) the land or property cannot be protected or
    recovered by any other means; or
    (B) the use of force other than deadly force to
    protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or
    another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.

    Texas Penal Code - Section 9.42. Deadly Force To Protect Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws
    I must say, I'm surprised that there would be laws like that in the USA. Valuing property over human life is more of a part of the culture of certain other nations.

    Maybe Texas is different.
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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents[W:76]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Police will be scrutinized and have to justify that the fleeing suspect was a threat to the public. They simply cannot shoot a suspect for running away if they cannot verbally articulate why the suspect was a potential threat. This is why Wilson is on shaky ground when it comes to shooting at Brown while he was running away from him (even if none of them hit and assuming he did), because the SCOTUS has already ruled that police are not allowed to shoot a suspect for simply stealing property in Tennessee v Gardner. The police cannot simply say "that guy stole this guy's stuff, so I shot him because I couldn't foresee any other way to retrieve the property", but a regular citizen can say "he stole my stuff so I shot him as he ran away" and be justified.

    Texas justifiable homicides rise with 'Castle Doctrine' - Houston Chronicle

    This type of law does lead to the cases we see that someone simply sees someone on their property, even if it is for an innocent purpose, and they end up killing that person. I just wish there was a middle ground. This allows a person to literally run after someone who has stolen from them and shoot at them so long as the person is within range. I would hope that if they ended up shooting someone else, that they would get charged, but it does increase the possibility of them shooting an innocent bystander in their mad rush to protect their property.

    Luckily, these incidents, although increasing, are still rare in themselves.
    Now you sound like Boddisatva....ALL such incidents are closely scrutinized....for cops and for citizens. this is why anyone, esp. the citizen would be foolish to use their firearm unless they absolutely have no choice. Which is pretty much the law(s) surrounding the use of lethal force.

    (The legal costs (for citizens) can lose you your house even if you were found innocent.)

    It ALL has to be justified and it all will be scrutinized. Every shoot. Every shot fired.
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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    If you've seen some outpouring of respect or concern for or even just an attempt at understanding the people behind the badge, you've been hanging out where I haven't. Maybe it's the uniform that leads people to believe cops are no longer to be regarded as human and should be discarded with no more concern than one would have over a defective dishwasher.
    Or maybe its that they in fact lack humanity.. The training process teaches them to remove emotion and follow protocol. Perhaps the outbursts of rage, is just the human condition breaking through the artificial training.
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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

    Soon, there will be no police officers in these neighborhoods. No one will apply.

    That'll help, I'm sure.

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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Soon, there will be no police officers in these neighborhoods. No one will apply.

    That'll help, I'm sure.
    If that actually happened, it might be interesting (from an intellectual perspective, not an emotional one) to see what developed.
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    Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Yep, any displays of humanity while wearing a badge makes you a worthless waste of oxygen. Maybe if we're lucky, they'll do the honorable thing, right? When was the last time someone expressed sadness over a cop losing his/her life or acknowledging a job well done? Actually, getting away from law enforcement is probably the best thing to happen to them. I swear they should all just walk off the job since almost nobody gives a **** about what happens to them anyway.
    I recognize and applaud the good things that they do whenever I see, read or hear it. My father was a CO for over 2/3 of my life, I have a deep respect for the police. Nevertheless, that does not stop me from criticizing them when criticism is needed. It's called integrity.

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