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Thread: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by JC_CT View Post
    It's not at all long standing though. It is a commitment made in 2004.
    So, if I'm hearing you correctly, going forward we should tell the world that our premisses, agreements, and treaties aren't worth the paper they are written on unless we wrote them a long time ago. Hmm. Typical Progressive Logic.

    Once again, this Administration is playing checkers, when the rest of the world leaders are playing chess.

    Just out of curiosity, why do you think we entered into that treaty in the first place?
    Wake Up America!

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    For 6 years now there have been so many twists, conspiracies, and complaints, and let down's with this guy...I don't think he ever really cared about the job, or at least aspects that he doesn't like to do. When Obama came in he had purpose, he wanted to "fundamentally transform" the country...Some of us asked the question 'To what?'...Now we are finding out, he wanted a USA that was irrelevant to what goes on in the world. It is a vision that carries the dangerous attitude that if the US isn't a superpower, then we aren't a target...IMHO.
    I think in the beginning, Obama seemed like a breath of fresh air to a lot of people. In terms of "transformation," to a degree I understood the sentiment, because the prevailing world view of the US was of a nation that frequently stuck their nose in foreign affairs it had no business being involved in. Manipulating other nations out of self-interest. Considering our history, with examples like "School of the Americas" in Central/South America, supporting the Shah in Iran in the mid-20th century, etc, our reputation on the world stage was in the tank.

    Enter: Obama. I'd never heard of the man. A girl I worked with in college suddenly went very Pro-Obama, in her words, because he was "endorsed by Oprah." I don't think the importance of that endorsement can be overstated. Nor can the power of low-information voters in large numbers.

    I think he was in over his head from Day 1. The results of his foreign policy (or rather, lack of policy) are being seen today. The US is not perfect. I think we would have a stronger leg to stand on if we didn't privately employ the very shady "tactics" we publicly denounce. I can understand how we are viewed as hypocritical.

    Regardless, it is clear that we bring more stability to the world when we are ENGAGED internationally. The world IS safer & more secure. As my southern belle grandma says... "Them's the facts, sugar foot!" The chaos & instability seen worldwide is living proof of what happens when the US sticks its head in the sand. The US will always be a target. Not maintaining our assertiveness and PRESENCE, on a worldwide level, IMHO, makes us an even BIGGER target. And yes, that's extremely dangerous.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    We waste trillions on a bunch of sand fleas and yet we are skeptical if we can go into another war (especially since this one might actually be NECESSARY).
    -----MOS 19D = cavalry scout = best damn MOS there is

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    How do you fix things after a world-wide nuclear war?

    Fill us in. We really need to know this.
    How far does nuclear fallout infect the landscape.

    I need to know if I need to move farther down in Mexico.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    I'm just pointing out the main reason why someone in the USA, like President Obama for example, needs to keep a level head while so many people are eager for instant answers to every foreign crisis.

    Nukes give you almost instant answers, but who's going to clean up the world-wide nuclear mess after they incinerate and contaminate humanity?


    The Syrian question has been on the table for about three years.

    The Syrian policy from Obama is, well, it is yet to be revealed.

    What a guy!
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    How far does nuclear fallout infect the landscape.

    I need to know if I need to move farther down in Mexico.


    Probably somewhere down around the southern end of Patagonia should be OK.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    The Syrian question has been on the table for about three years.

    The Syrian policy from Obama is, well, it is yet to be revealed
    .

    What a guy!


    No matter who 'wins' in Syria it's not likely that they'll ever be good buddies with the USA, but we sure don't want ISIS in charge there.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    I'm just pointing out the main reason why someone in the USA, like President Obama for example, needs to keep a level head while so many people are eager for instant answers to every foreign crisis.

    Nukes give you almost instant answers, but who's going to clean up the world-wide nuclear mess after they incinerate and contaminate humanity?
    So you're not really trying to discuss as much as just poke holes in others opinions and input...Ok...That really doesn't help anything either.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by Doppelgangirl View Post
    I think in the beginning, Obama seemed like a breath of fresh air to a lot of people. In terms of "transformation," to a degree I understood the sentiment, because the prevailing world view of the US was of a nation that frequently stuck their nose in foreign affairs it had no business being involved in. Manipulating other nations out of self-interest. Considering our history, with examples like "School of the Americas" in Central/South America, supporting the Shah in Iran in the mid-20th century, etc, our reputation on the world stage was in the tank.

    Enter: Obama. I'd never heard of the man. A girl I worked with in college suddenly went very Pro-Obama, in her words, because he was "endorsed by Oprah." I don't think the importance of that endorsement can be overstated. Nor can the power of low-information voters in large numbers.

    I think he was in over his head from Day 1. The results of his foreign policy (or rather, lack of policy) are being seen today. The US is not perfect. I think we would have a stronger leg to stand on if we didn't privately employ the very shady "tactics" we publicly denounce. I can understand how we are viewed as hypocritical.

    Regardless, it is clear that we bring more stability to the world when we are ENGAGED internationally. The world IS safer & more secure. As my southern belle grandma says... "Them's the facts, sugar foot!" The chaos & instability seen worldwide is living proof of what happens when the US sticks its head in the sand. The US will always be a target. Not maintaining our assertiveness and PRESENCE, on a worldwide level, IMHO, makes us an even BIGGER target. And yes, that's extremely dangerous.
    A good assessment of Obama, but I have a very hard time squaring your assertion the world is "better off" with America "sticking it's nose in" where it doesn't belong.

    Since before day one, I have been comparing Obama to James Earl Carter, he also creator of a disaster of a foreign policy. Both are really average at the end of the day, both were outsiders promising "change" although the audacious Mr. Obama added the word "hope", which is now....well...

    And, they both had no clue as to how things really work. Obama promised everything to "his" supporters while making "enemies" of those who didn't absolutely adore him. A rookie, with just two years, not even a complete term, he failed to realize those "enemies" are Americans too, and like him have been elected to do a job. So unlike Carter, Reagan and George H.W. Bush, he saw no purpose in having his "enemies" to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. for lunch and casual chat about how to get some things done, seek what was founded the US, that long forgotten thing called "compromise".

    He took a naive view to Europe and while being basked in adoration over a politically motivated peace prize, he failed to hear the murmurs of US allies, that maybe he didn't have what it takes. Then off to the middle east to "apologize" to Arabs, leaving Israel and US Jews wondering what the hell is going on. Oops, another ally alienated.

    From there, I believe he sought to correct his errors [without of course admitting them] and reverted to the Bush+Bush policy of might makes right. I truly believe he now seriously regrets pulling troops out of Iraq then. And I also believe even he now knows he's in way over his head.
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
    Donald Trump, 11/23/17

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    Re: WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    No matter who 'wins' in Syria it's not likely that they'll ever be good buddies with the USA, but we sure don't want ISIS in charge there.
    That's for sure.

    3 years ago before ISIS became a cohesive entity, it would have been nice if the Big 0 had done something.

    Analysis Paralysis. He and Kerry are well paired. Together, they can examine the bejeebers out of anything and decide with confidence that they are both the smartest guys around.

    Of course, the issue is unaffected by their combined brilliance.
    Last edited by code1211; 09-01-14 at 03:27 PM.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

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