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Thread: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Who else but Obama????? Obama was in charge when Iraq was stable. Now after he pulled the troops, against the advice of the military, thousands of people are dead and the military is having to go back. He is clearly responsible. No???
    Iraq was never stable. It had a stubborn, corrupt, and sectarian PM (Maliki) so the conditions were ripe for the sectarian strife that contributed to the creation of ISIS. That instability was created by the fall of Saddam Hussein. Saddam was taken down by Bush. You know when Iraq was really stable? When Saddam Hussein was there, before he invaded Kuwait, and before Bush Sr.'s ambassador suggested to him that America wouldn't mind his invading Kuwait. So, the problem goes way back.

    So, no, there are indeed more people to blame other than just Obama. On the other hand, like I said, Obama is clearly ALSO to blame.

    Now, see, I blame both Republican and Democratic administrations. That's called analyzing the situation logically and historically without partisan blindness. I don't think I can say the same of some opinions being expressed here today.

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    That's false, of course, but even more lives will be lost because the troops aren't there maintaining the stable situation which was in Iraq at the time.
    This isn't false, you've proven it.

    You lament the loss of Iraqi lives complaining that our troops aren't being killed right along side of them. Of course had we not left Iraq, you would be complaining that Obama had not followed the Bush exit plan. At least admit there is absolutely no action Obama could take that you wouldn't gripe and complain.

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    This isn't false, you've proven it.

    You lament the loss of Iraqi lives complaining that our troops aren't being killed right along side of them. Of course had we not left Iraq, you would be complaining that Obama had not followed the Bush exit plan. At least admit there is absolutely no action Obama could take that you wouldn't gripe and complain.
    While I don't particularly like Argument By Hypothetical, I have very little doubt that you are correct here.
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatNews2night View Post
    Iraq was never stable. It had a stubborn, corrupt, and sectarian PM (Maliki) so the conditions were ripe for the sectarian strife that contributed to the creation of ISIS. That instability was created by the fall of Saddam Hussein. Saddam was taken down by Bush. You know when Iraq was really stable? When Saddam Hussein was there, before he invaded Kuwait, and before Bush Sr.'s ambassador suggested to him that America wouldn't mind his invading Kuwait. So, the problem goes way back.

    So, no, there are indeed more people to blame other than just Obama. On the other hand, like I said, Obama is clearly ALSO to blame.

    Now, see, I blame both Republican and Democratic administrations. That's called analyzing the situation logically and historically without partisan blindness. I don't think I can say the same of some opinions being expressed here today.
    Grant knows this. He's just using the situation to bitch about Obama. I think he lives with Navy Pride.

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Is Obama required by the War Powers Act to consult them on starting wars?
    Wouldn't that be a violation of your constitutional rights for him not to consult congress?
    Meanwhile, the warhawks of Congress run around the Nation acting like they're all the Chiefs and Obama is the Indian .
    That's funny, the "War Powers Act." It's not part of the Constitution, and is really unconstitutional. But it will never go to court, because presidents ignore it anyway, and Congress won't bother, since they know it would be struct down.
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    Educator GreatNews2night's Avatar
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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    Sorry, we don't all have special Obama decoder rings to get the message that you got. This probably would not matter all that much, it would be just a gaffe, but it's another in a long line of screw ups by this disaster of a president.
    Well, it looks like you haven't read subsequent posts on how the discussion of the issue has evolved.
    Just to update you,
    1. The phrase is probably unfortunate and half-akin to a gaffe but it was taken out of context and conveniently for Obama's opponents other statements issued *during the same address* signaling just the opposite (that is, that ISIS is likely in for a big blow from America) were conveniently omitted. Whoever heard the whole speech and not just mutilated versions by partisan media, knows that the president did not mean that nothing will be done against ISIS.
    2. The president is not that weak against terrorists.
    3. This said, the president is to partially blame for the Iraq situation, which resulted, sure, from previous blunders (Bush's, Maliki's) but also resulted from the president's poor leadership skills, lack of statesman-like behavior, and faulty foreign policy

    Now, quoting a much earlier post of mine pretending that none of the above has been discussed is a bit disingenuous.

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    While I don't particularly like Argument By Hypothetical, I have very little doubt that you are correct here.
    You are right, but some people...well they shouldn't play poker, they are very predictable. Pegging them with a hypothetical is like agreeing with the theory of evolution.
    Last edited by Texmex; 09-02-14 at 12:19 AM. Reason: spelling

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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Oh so you're saying congress is so impotent and can do NOTHING? Wow what a defeatist attitude the GOP and you have.

    The country is at stake remember? A real set of leaders would bring up suggestions on what to do if they thought the president incompetent and not just whine like ****ing cry-babies about it.
    Just an incredibly ignorant statement.
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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatNews2night View Post
    Iraq was never stable. It had a stubborn, corrupt, and sectarian PM (Maliki) so the conditions were ripe for the sectarian strife that contributed to the creation of ISIS.
    If Iraq was not stable, and maliki as you described, why pull the troops?

    That instability was created by the fall of Saddam Hussein. Saddam was taken down by Bush.
    Whoa! Are you saying that Iraq was 'stable' under Saddam Hussein? You are unaware of the war with Iran, the genocide or the rape rooms? How was any of this 'stable'. Who taught you this?

    You know when Iraq was really stable? When Saddam Hussein was there, before he invaded Kuwait, and before Bush Sr.'s ambassador suggested to him that America wouldn't mind his invading Kuwait. So, the problem goes way back.
    Yes, he invaded Kuwait. And you say that he did so because an Ambassador said it was okay?? I've heard that nonsense before but no one invades another country because of a wink or a nudge from an ambassador! Even Saddam Hussein.

    So, no, there are indeed more people to blame other than just Obama. On the other hand, like I said, Obama is clearly ALSO to blame.
    You are so close, but missed it.

    Now, see, I blame both Republican and Democratic administrations. That's called analyzing the situation logically and historically without partisan blindness. I don't think I can say the same of some opinions being expressed here today.
    Yes, I know. Everyone's to blame and no one's to blame and it's all history's fault.

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    Educator GreatNews2night's Avatar
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    re: Obama under fire for admitting no 'strategy yet' for ISIS in Syria [W:446]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    If Iraq was not stable, and maliki as you described, why pull the troops?
    I've already explained that I'm against the pulling of the troops and it is the basis for me ALSO blaming Obama.
    Whoa! Are you saying that Iraq was 'stable' under Saddam Hussein? You are unaware of the war with Iran, the genocide or the rape rooms? How was any of this 'stable'. Who taught you this?
    Stable as far as terrorism goes. Saddam as a dictator was oppressing his people and was bellicose against neighbors but terrorists had no space to thrive there.
    Yes, he invaded Kuwait. And you say that he did so because an Ambassador said it was okay?? I've heard that nonsense before but no one invades another country because of a wink or a nudge from an ambassador! Even Saddam Hussein.
    Right, you've heard it before. It's not nonsense; it's called a diplomatic blunder.
    You are so close, but missed it.
    I think you're the one missing all the other factors, and narrowly considering only one factor.
    Yes, I know. Everyone's to blame and no one's to blame and it's all history's fault.
    Don't put words in my mouth. I never said no one is to blame. It's a complex situation with multiple causes and multiple people screwed up, which is frankly quite incredible that you are unable to see.

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