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Thread: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

  1. #241
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    The United States has always taken an interest in the affairs of its citizens abroad. We have routinely (from the time of Washington onward) engaged in financial, political, or military dealings for the sake of protecting, saving, or ameliorating the difficulties of our citizens around the world. I think this is a principle we should retain.
    If someone does something stupid and walks into a war zone, they take responsibility for their own actions.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    You've gone back to making the same straw man argument. It isn't about the amount of weaponry sold, it is about who it was sold to. Russian weaponry has killed far more civilians than US weapons have... but I am sure you aren't counting the millions dead at the hands of the Chinese, the North Koreans, the Viet Cong and The Khmer Rouge just for starters.

    Also note that your new evidence for your straw man argument proves your initial argument was also false:



    Again, FALSE!
    You said in the last forty years, now you want to go back eighty. Can't debate like that. Furthermore. I said the US was the biggest arms dealer and you came back and said no, that Russia is. So I said fine, then the US is the second biggest, and then you said no, China, Iran and a couple others were in front of us. And then I proved you wrong on that, too!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    They will continue to try and kidnap Americans regardless. It is a propaganda coup to kidnap an American whether they are used for ransom or execution. It is simplistic to assume that this really has an impact on their calculus. We have paid ransoms for decades to these sorts of groups. Sometimes they ransom them, sometimes they exchange them, sometimes they just execute them or have we already forgotten Foley and Daniel Pearl? Saving life should be a priority in these cases, not pointless posturing.
    And that's up to them but they have to own the consequences of their actions. If they want to kidnap American citizens, then maybe we'll just use their leaders for pinpoint bombing practice. If they choose to hide among their civilian population, that's their choice, maybe their civilians ought to hold their leadership responsible for their bad leadership decisions.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  4. #244
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    When it comes to another culture, we have to understand that our opinions mean nothing. It means about as much to them as my opinion about what you should have for lunch means to you. That's something they get to decide for themselves, using whatever criteria they decide to use. They have, or at least ought to have, the right to self determination. However, the United States has stuffed our nose in their business for so long, we've pushed them to become a western-style democracy, to do what we want them to do, we've spent so much time ordering the planet around because we've got a big dick and we want to swing it, we've lost the realization that it's their nation and their culture to do with as they choose, so long as they don't go around and attack us and involve us in their mess.

    What the Middle East wants to do with their oil is up to them. Our desires don't amount to a hill of beans. We have no claim whatsoever on their natural resources.
    Why are you speaking to me about this as though we disagree? JFC dude, get a grip on this!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  5. #245
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    The United States has always taken an interest in the affairs of its citizens abroad. We have routinely (from the time of Washington onward) engaged in financial, political, or military dealings for the sake of protecting, saving, or ameliorating the difficulties of our citizens around the world. I think this is a principle we should retain.
    Agreed!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  6. #246
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Wrong, it was an unequal government from its inception and never would have answered. Look, its arrogant to think you can go conduct regime change and declare democracy, and then walk away. You either don't leave at all after forcing people to do something at gun point or you you change people's minds and hearts thru peaceful means. But the US is the snot nosed kid on the block in terms of age, and as such inexperienced at it. Worst thing is that, democracy is quite threatened at home and civil liberties are eroding daily, yet were trying to force democracy at gun point over yonder, and we have people, here on this board even, that defend both.
    Actually Roadvirus is correct. Obama Flashback: 'We're Leaving Behind a Sovereign, Stable and Self-Reliant Iraq'

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    What do we have to do about her? She went to Syria of her own accord. How is that the responsibility of the United States government?
    I agree with you. She has to accept the consequences of her actions, as we all do.

    But having said that I believe her kidnappers and their supporters should be bombed back to the stone age, not a very long trip anyway.

  8. #248
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Nope, neither Bush or Obama were correct on Iraq.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Nope, neither Bush or Obama were correct on Iraq.
    How about this guy? Watch Joe Biden Call Iraq "One of the Great Achievements of This Administration" | The Daily Caller

  10. #250
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I agree with you. She has to accept the consequences of her actions, as we all do.

    But having said that I believe her kidnappers and their supporters should be bombed back to the stone age, not a very long trip anyway.
    I'm fine with that, if for no other reason than to discourage them from messing with American citizens for potential profit. If you kidnap our people, if you kill our people, we're going to blow the crap out of you and out of your civilian population. We will hurt you far worse than you hurt us and the more you do it, the more it will escalate until there's none of you left.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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