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Thread: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

  1. #151
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    There is no link there so I have to take it as opinion, and one poorly formed. I seriously doubt the entire nation of Islam is of the faith that "killing infidels" is fun. If you were to read the Koran, and what it calls the faithful to do, you would find that anyone following that religion would not welcome death, but fear it like the rest of us as they too believe in final judgement.

    No entire nation can be so crassly and sweepingly identified and judged. Would you dare say that all blacks are criminals, of that all Jews are cheats?

    Same bigoted, racial stereo-typing; you have been taught to hate all Muslims in the xenophobic propaganda campaign following 911.
    I said "Islamic Radicals"... do you see all Muslims as Islamic Radicals?
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    I said "Islamic Radicals"... do you see all Muslims as Islamic Radicals?
    No but you do
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    No but you do
    No I don't. I see Islamic Radicals as Islamic radicals. Somehow me mentioning the patently obvious that Islamic radicals are killing themselves to get to heaven has your panties in a twist and accusing me of things I never said.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  4. #154
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by zoetherat View Post
    It's better if we don't pay these types of ransoms. Ever. If we did, we'd just turn the taking of American hostages into a business and end up financing Isis with it. I also don't think there's really much we can do to stop these killings either. We just have to remember that far more Americans die from car accidents then will ever be killed by Isis.
    Not if we weren't there it wouldn't.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    No I don't. I see Islamic Radicals as Islamic radicals. Somehow me mentioning the patently obvious that Islamic radicals are killing themselves to get to heaven has your panties in a twist and accusing me of things I never said.


    But that's all you and every other American talk about, radicals as if all Muslims are radicals and I am sick of it.

    Every "radical" is having "fun" killing while we have video and tape evidence of American soldiers laughing as their rockets slaughter people, in one case an American journalist.

    But post one picture of a machine gun aimed at a kid's head and a terrified nation demands yet another invasion without even proof the guns are held by Muslims or ISIS, they could be American boy scouts.

    I have seldom seen on an American board one comment nor link to a Muslim organization that has deplored these attacks and when they do occur, there are 3 to one posts claiming its all lies. Watching American television and film, one gets the clear idea that, as you have asserted [albeit with the world weary phrase "extremists"] Muslims really, really like killing, and believe they will go to heaven for doing so. It is ignored that Muslims have been living among you, winning world boxing titles, curing cancer, inventing telephone aps since the early 1900's. It has never occurred to anyone that Muslims live in peace in Canada [that claim always gets challenged with claims of riots in Canadian cities, but there is never a link], that they live as a majority in Indonesia, a land with a fraction of the crime rate of even your best city.

    But that NEVER gets mentioned anywhere in US media.
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
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  6. #156
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    There are no rules. There are only things that are more or less effective. If dealing with a group that only understands violence, then using violence against that group is called for. You can't reason with the unreasonable.
    Considering our foreign policy in the ME has been primarily violence, I'd say we have a good idea of what it is to only understand violence. Violence begets violence, do a kind deed to the guy next to you on the bus and see if he responds to it by punching you in the nose. Basically, if we don't see enough Americans pull their heads out and acknowledge failed US policy in the ME instead of arguing over which party is responsible, we're going to eventually feel the pain. And it would appear that the guy you're responding to there would be fine that we become the evil we seek to defeat.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    It might sound cold, however when somebody goes to a **** hole like Syria they should sign a release form at the airport stating they know they are on their own if something like this happens.

    She had no business being there in the first place.
    Yeah, ok. Sad thing is, before the US supported violence to overthrow president Assad (our favourite ME policy) Americans vacationed there. We need to bring this woman back. If it was your daughter you'd agree, so don't be selfish. I would agree that all Americans in Syria should be told to leave. But then they should probably be told to leave all the countries in which we've created enemies. I'll spare you the list, it may be lengthy.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  8. #158
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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Considering our foreign policy in the ME has been primarily violence, I'd say we have a good idea of what it is to only understand violence. Violence begets violence, do a kind deed to the guy next to you on the bus and see if he responds to it by punching you in the nose. Basically, if we don't see enough Americans pull their heads out and acknowledge failed US policy in the ME instead of arguing over which party is responsible, we're going to eventually feel the pain. And it would appear that the guy you're responding to there would be fine that we become the evil we seek to defeat.
    It isn't just the ME that we have a problem with, American foreign policy in general has failed because it's based on "we're America, you do what we want". It's been that way for a long, long time, we want to lead the show, we don't want to be an equal partner in world governance. We depose democratically elected governments because they don't follow our orders, we impose political systems and dictators on people who don't want them, we prop them up with money and weapons and eventually and invariably, we always have to go in and take them out when they stop taking our directions. This is how the entire Middle East, and elsewhere, has been run for decades, going back into the 50s and beyond. What we've done to the world is coming home to roost, we've radicalized much of the Middle East through our actions and while I agree that continuing to meet violence with violence isn't a good thing, it really is the only option because the radical elements in the Middle East are not capable of reason. You can't talk to them. They have an irrational hatred of all things western and want nothing more than to see us all dead. There are only two things that we can do over the long term to defuse the situation. Get the hell out of their business, pull our interests out of the Middle East as much as possible and show them that we do not respond well to threats. Let them run their own countries and if they try to attack others, stomp them into the ground and then pull back again.

    This isn't an ethical problem. This is a logistical problem. We lost the moral high ground a long, long time ago.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    What George Bush broke? Try again Monte.


    How Reaganís Mideast Policy Won the Cold War.....


    Ronald Reaganís centenary coincides with the unraveling of Ronald Reaganís Middle East. The president born February 6, 1911, is most associated with the dramatic end of the Cold War in Europe. But you can make a powerful case that the Cold War was won ó not in Europe ó but in the Middle East. Four events were decisive. 1. The Reagan administration cemented Egypt, the largest and most important Arab country, into the U.S. alliance system.

    Banished from Egypt, the Soviets developed a relationship with the second strongest Arab state, Iraq. On June 7, 1981, Israeli jets smashed the Iraqi nuclear reactor at Osirak. The Reagan administration joined the UN condemnation of Israel. Yet the U.S. benefited enormously from the act it condemned. Lacking nuclear weapons, on the defensive in the war it had launched against Iran in September 1980, Iraq was forced into greater economic dependence on the Gulf Arab states aligned with the U.S. ó another blow to Soviet influence. 3. Middle East events forced the Soviet Union toward an (ultimately doomed) reconstruction of its economy.....snip~

    How Reaganís Mideast Policy Won the Cold War
    It was Reagan that created the first power vacuum in the ME. He armed the Mujahideen. This denied the soviets influence in Afghanistan, but it gave rise to an American enemy, the Taliban, which we then had to spend a trillion dollars and how much blood now? fighting them there. And when we leave here in a little bit, it will NOT be a democracy. Add that trillion dollars to Reagan's national debt and he quadrupled it instead of tripling it.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS Demands $6.6M Ransom for 26-Year-Old American Woman.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It isn't just the ME that we have a problem with, American foreign policy in general has failed because it's based on "we're America, you do what we want". It's been that way for a long, long time, we want to lead the show, we don't want to be an equal partner in world governance. We depose democratically elected governments because they don't follow our orders, we impose political systems and dictators on people who don't want them, we prop them up with money and weapons and eventually and invariably, we always have to go in and take them out when they stop taking our directions. This is how the entire Middle East, and elsewhere, has been run for decades, going back into the 50s and beyond. What we've done to the world is coming home to roost, we've radicalized much of the Middle East through our actions and while I agree that continuing to meet violence with violence isn't a good thing, it really is the only option because the radical elements in the Middle East are not capable of reason. You can't talk to them. They have an irrational hatred of all things western and want nothing more than to see us all dead. There are only two things that we can do over the long term to defuse the situation. Get the hell out of their business, pull our interests out of the Middle East as much as possible and show them that we do not respond well to threats. Let them run their own countries and if they try to attack others, stomp them into the ground and then pull back again.

    This isn't an ethical problem. This is a logistical problem. We lost the moral high ground a long, long time ago.
    Great post Cephus, now required reading for all 5th graders! Won't see me disagreeing with a thing you stated there! Lets just hope more Americans begin to realise it.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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