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Thread: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot[W:72,732]

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    To my knowledge the only thing released so far is a map of MBs body showing the wound entries....so you tell me which ones had "stippling."

    Neither of the first two autopsies showed any trace of gun powder residue on MB hands or anywhere else on his body. That would support Johnson's story, not the officers.
    We don't have all of the officer's story at this time. We have no idea what exactly his story would be or why there would need to be gun powder on Brown's hands. Just trying to take the gun wouldn't produce gun powder. So there is no contradiction with just having the absence of gun powder residue even when it comes to a claim that Brown was reaching for Wilson's weapon. It is possible to reach for the gun without getting gun powder on your hands, especially a gun that hadn't been fired yet.

    And from what I can tell, the absence of gun powder doesn't provide any kind of evidence for or against Johnson's story.
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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Why are you so keen to discount Johnson's testimony?
    Have you noticed the discrepancies with his story?

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    We don't have all of the officer's story at this time. We have no idea what exactly his story would be or why there would need to be gun powder on Brown's hands. Just trying to take the gun wouldn't produce gun powder. So there is no contradiction with just having the absence of gun powder residue even when it comes to a claim that Brown was reaching for Wilson's weapon. It is possible to reach for the gun without getting gun powder on your hands, especially a gun that hadn't been fired yet.

    And from what I can tell, the absence of gun powder doesn't provide any kind of evidence for or against Johnson's story.
    The officer had a spokesperson called "Josie" that told his side of the story. It's in the CNN link that I posted earlier. The Ferguson Police chief also repeated parts of Wilson's story to the press. So we do sorta have the officers story but it's not holding water where the tussle inside the cruiser is concerned.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    ...so you tell me which ones had "stippling."
    They indicated there was not any stippling around the wounds. No gun powder (stippling) found on the body would indicate it was a shot from a bit further away.

    When a gun is fired, a cloud of gas from the gunpowder's ignition explodes outward, along with soot and unburned gunpowder, Davis said. If a shooter holds the gun so that the muzzle is in contact with the victim's skin, the gas injects itself into the body, either tearing the skin or leaving abrasions from the contact with the muzzle. A shot from an inch or so away will spare the skin from the gas, but leave soot around the wound. In contrast, a shot from between 3 and 9 inches (7.62 to 22.86 centimeters) away won't deposit any soot, but it will leave a characteristic "stippling" pattern from fast-flying gunpowder. A distance greater than about 9 inches between the skin and the gun, depending on the gun, would be categorized as a "distant wound," Davis said.
    Ferguson, Missouri, police shooting: What Michael Brown's autopsy can (and can't) tell us - CBS News

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Another witness, Michael Brady said that he saw MB doubled over and "grabbing his stomach" while the gun shots kept firing. So it would make more sense that the officer was still "pursuing" MB (Josie admitted as much) after he turned around....not the other way around.
    Moving toward Officer Wilson. If he was moving toward him, he could still be considered a threat. Since he hadn't been shot anywhere near his stomach, it is likely that he could have been crossing his arms, either to protect his arm (that likely might have been hit by then) or to tuck in to charge the officer. We simply don't know.

    I can picture an explainable situation in my head. One shot in the car, possibly hit hand or arm (no idea if it did or not but there would be evidence). More shots as running (out of however many, don't know), one may have clipped arm. Wilson was in pursuit of Brown then. Brown stops and turns around, either putting his hands up or reaching down to tuck in or grab injury, this part is unclear. Perhaps doing more than one of these. At this point, at the most he would have had two wounds to the arm (if any at all), both superficial, which aren't likely to cause major problems with standing up straight, nor would either, assuming he had at least one but even both, likely be fatal. We don't know what was said after Brown turned around. Some said he said he was shot or "Don't shoot", others that he was taunting Wilson to shoot him. Either are possible. According to a witness, Brown moved toward Wilson, at least a step or two after he turned to face him. If he actually did do that movement, then it could be viewed as a threat, which might be the reason that more shots were fired. Those shots were fired quickly. Now, it may come down to did Brown move before or after he was shot after turning toward Wilson and what reason Wilson gives for viewing Brown as a continuing threat after he turned around.

    Pursuing him would not mean executing him. Generally, if a suspect stops and turns around, the officer pursuing will at the least slow down, if not stop, too, particularly if he/she is trying to aim his/her gun at them.
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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Meadowlark View Post
    Have you noticed the discrepancies with his story?
    I've noticed discrepancies in everyone's story....especially the police. But you only seem to notice Johnson's and even there you don't seem to know much. So how come you're so keen to discredit him?

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by JC_CT View Post
    There is no question in my mind that parts of Johnson's account are, as you put it, enhanced. That doesn't at all mean that we take his entire testimony and throw it out the window. We don't consider his word to be 100% solid on its own, but we take it into consideration as a piece of a larger body of evidence.

    There are parts of his testimony that even the PD isn't disputing. We know for a fact that not all of his testimony is a lie, so why would we treat it as such?

    Tiffany Mitchell, Paiget Crenshaw, Emanual Freeman (@TheePharaoh), Michael Brady, and the aforementioned Dorian Johnson all stated that Wilson fired at Brown as Brown was running away. The man in the background of the so-called "game changer" video didn't explicitly say one way or another, but if anything his use of the language "the police KEPT dumping on him" when first directly referring to gunfire would lean towards evidence that there was prior gunfire - but should reasonably be classified as inconclusive. Now we have an alleged tape recording of the gun shots which doesn't provide hard proof, but fits well with the scenario of shots fired at Brown's back, followed by a separate volley of shots fired at his front.

    Oh yeah, and 9 days ago The New York Times reported that law enforcement officials confirmed that Wilson fired his weapon as Brown and Johnson were running away but didn't hit anyone, and nobody involved in the investigation has tried to deny it to my knowledge.

    So now we have the police confirming a key aspect of multiple eyewitnesses' accounts, including Johnson's. There is a person claiming to speak on behalf of someone who witnessed the shooting that failed to mention the fact that shots were fired at Brown's back...Josie. In fact, im contrast to the man in the "game changer" video, she used the term "so he just STARTED shooting" to describe when Wilson opened fire when Brown was allegedly bumrushing him.

    So who's credibility is really lost?
    Thanks, we know Johnson enhanced his story, a small percentage was actually true because he left out major parts.
    With that, take in the information from all the other witnesses and you've got a good framework of what happened,
    but until we hear from Officer Wilson; we really don't know what happened from his perspective.

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    The officer had a spokesperson called "Josie" that told his side of the story. It's in the CNN link that I posted earlier. The Ferguson Police chief also repeated parts of Wilson's story to the press. So we do sorta have the officers story but it's not holding water where the tussle inside the cruiser is concerned.
    We have part of it, but no gun powder residue does not have any affect on it. He could have shot the gun from far enough away that there was no powder left or that it came off. They have had suicide victims (that shot themselves) test negative for gun powder residue. We can't actually know for sure if there should have been GSR on his hands or not, even if he had been reaching for the gun. Plus, "Josie" claimed that it was after Wilson shoved the weapon from his hip that it fired. So long as Brown's hands weren't still on it at that point, he wouldn't necessarily test positive for GSR.
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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    They indicated there was not any stippling around the wounds. No gun powder (stippling) found on the body would indicate it was a shot from a bit further away.



    Ferguson, Missouri, police shooting: What Michael Brown's autopsy can (and can't) tell us - CBS News
    If Michael Brown didn't have gun powder residue on him then wouldn't that discredit the officers story that he was trying to grab the officers gun when it went off?

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    Re: Attorney: New audio reveals pause in gunfire when Michael Brown was shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Meadowlark View Post
    Thanks, we know Johnson enhanced his story, a small percentage was actually true because he left out major parts.
    With that, take in the information from all the other witnesses and you've got a good framework of what happened,
    but until we hear from Officer Wilson; we really don't know what happened from his perspective.
    Which major parts did he leave out?

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